Discussion Topic

안녕하십니까?

너무나 오랜 만입니다. 

Faith Alive에서 새로운 주일학교 교재가 나왔습니다. WE라고 하는 교재와 DWELL이란 교재가 나왔습니다. 저도 직접 읽어보고 검토을 했습니다. 우리 한인교회에 추천하고 싶습니다. 

특별히 WE라고 하는 교재는 가정예배를 할 수 있도록 준비되어있습니다. 한달에 한번씩 교회에서 온 가족이 함께 모여 주님 안에서 즐거운 시간을 가질 수 있도록 준비되어있습니다. 재미도 있고, 진리도 담아 있습니다. 우리 한인교회의 가장 필요한 가정 예배/프로그램을...

September 2, 2011 0 1 comments
Discussion Topic

It's been a long time. I must apologize... I have no excuse.

우리 교단의 Home Mission을 섬기게 된 Moses Chung목사님을 위해 기도 부탁드립니다. 어려운 상황에 오시게 되었는데, 주님 안에서 흔들이지 않고 주님의 능력으로 우리 교회를 이를어 갈 수 있도록 기도합니다. 

1.5세로 그리고 처음으로 이 자리에 ethnic 리더가 되었습니다. 우리 모든 한인교회에서 기도와 협조로 정 목사를 후원하며 도울 수 있기를 바랍니다. 하나님께서 결정하신...

June 7, 2011 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

Shalom partners in the Lord!

As we saw our recent agenda for '11 Synod, we found many heavy and important issues in our denomination:

such as, report on leadership(p.55),  Intro. for the Ref. Confessions  Translation by Faith Alive Co 's report(p179ff),

.Ecumenical &...

May 11, 2011 0 2 comments
Discussion Topic

Here is something that comes from Dee in the Synod office. This is a good news for Korean churches.

We celebrate the completion and posting of the Korean translation of the Church Order and Its Supplements 2010. We are very grateful to Jay for providing the translation services, bringing...

January 4, 2011 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

Praise the Lord!

We had about 3000 attendees of college and young adults and even few high school students and elderly. We had over 500 people volunteer leaders and servants. What a blessed conference. God is always good.

Amazingly enough, this conference was put together in matter...

December 26, 2010 0 3 comments
Discussion Topic

남가주 오렌지 카운티에서 1월부터 작은 교회들 중심으로 교회 학교를 돕기 위한 프로그램을 시작하려고 합니다. 전도사나 사역자가 없는 교회들을 위한 프로그램이지만, 전도사나 교육 목사도 참여할 수 있습니다. 

여러차래에 교회 학교의 필요와 문제에 대한 말씀을 올렸습니다. 많은 교회에 사역자들이 부족하다는 말씀과 교회 학교는 프로그램이 아니고 사역이 되어야 한다는 중요한 말씀을 여러차래에 올렸습니다. 말만하고 도움을 드릴수 없으면 무슨 소영이 있겠습니까?

먼저 남가주 샘솟는 교회에서 시작을 합니다. 교회의...

December 5, 2010 0 1 comments
Discussion Topic

12윌 20일 부터 23일 까지 센디에고에서 약 4000명의 청년들이 모여 하나님을 찬양하며 주님의 음성을 듣고 삶의 새로운 부름을 받고자 합니다.

기도 부탁드립니다.

우리 교단에서도 적극적으로 참여하며 혐조를 하고 있습니다. 세계선교 (CRWM) 에서는 세미나를 하나 인도합니다. Leadership Exchange 와 Faith Alive와 세계선교에서 함께 부스를 함께 운영할 것입니다. 우리 교단에서 이렇게 적극적으로 청년들을 위해 협조하는 모습에 감사합니다.

아직 많은 자리가 남아있습니다...

November 22, 2010 0 1 comments
Discussion Topic

우리 교회의 가장 큰 문제요, 가장 급한 필요가 있습니다. 특별히 작은 교회의 문제 입니다.

우리 자녀들을 가르치는 교사/전도사/사역자들이 예배를 드리지 못한다는 것입니다. 건물을 빌려 예배를 드리는 교회에서는 어른 예배때 어린이들을 가르치는 사역자들은 예배를 드리지 못합니다. 교역자가 없는 교회에서도 사역자들은 예배를 드리지 못합니다. 많은 교회/성도들 생각은 아이들 사역을 Baby Sitting 으로 생각하며, 어른 예배나 프로그램에 어린 학생들이 문제만 만들지 않고, 조용히만 있으면 된다는 생각으로 운영하는...

November 9, 2010 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

주님 안에서 편안하십니까? 오랜만에 글을 올립니다.

남가주에서 연합으로 선교 대회를 가지게 됩니다. 12/20-23 에 San Diego에서 약 4,000 예상으로 대학생들과 청년들을 위한 선교 대회입니다. 우리 교단 목사님들도 여러분 참석하며 함께 준비하고 있습니다. 

자세한 내용은 www.gkym.org에 가셔서 보시면 되겠습니다. 대부분 영어로 진행됩니다. 한국에 track도 있습니다. 각 교회의 대학 청년들을 보내 주시기 바랍니다. 선교뿐 아니라, 젊은이들을 위한 신앙과 생활 세미나들이 많이...

November 9, 2010 0 1 comments
Discussion Topic

2세 교육/목회를 위해 여러가지 방법을 생각해보고 글도 올립니다. 도움이 되는지 모르겠네요.

2세 교육/목회을 위해 무엇이 필요하십니까? 어떻게 도와드리는 것이 가장 도움이 되겠습니까?

2세 교육/목회만 아니고, 교회가 가장 필요한 것이 무엇입니까? 도와 드리고 싶습니다. 

교단의 많은 자료와 도움들이 있습니다. 

필요를 올려주세요.

주인석 

October 12, 2010 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

대부분의 교회는 영어목회자를 구합니다. 자녀들을 가르칠 교역자들을 원하고 있습니다. 전도사, 목사 상관없이 많은 교회는 이들을 찾고 있습니다. 하지만, 교역자들은 부족합니다. 모든 교회의 필요를 채우려면 십년이 지나도 가능할까요?

하지만, 다른 방법이 있습니다. 교역자를 여러 이유로 구할 수 없는 교회는 교회 안에서 교역자를 키우면 됩니다. 가능할까요? 절대로 가능합니다.

제가 섬기던 교회에서도 교회 안에서 자란 학생들을 키우고 세워 지금까지 잘 섬기고 있습니다. 교회 안에서 세워진 사람들은 교회를...

September 20, 2010 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

 우리 한인교회의 가장 큰 고민과 사역은 우리 자녀입니다. 영어권으로 자란 이제 성인이 된 자녀들입니다. 벌써 많은 세대를 섬기지 못해 많이 잃었습니다. 모든 교회가 EM을 세우고  많은 EM 교회가 생기고 있습니다. 

EM은 동립되어야 하는가? 제 경험과 지혜로 말씀드리면 Yes and No 입니다.

먼저 NO에대해 말씀 드리고 싶습니다. 많은 EM 목회자들이 영어권의 청년들을 대리고 교회를 시작했습니다. 몇 교회말고는 성공했다고 보기 힘듭니다. 그 이유는 목회자들도 준비가 되지 않은 상태와 EM의...

September 11, 2010 0 4 comments
Discussion Topic

 우리교회의 교육 프로그램이 가지고 있는 문제들이 많이 있습니다. 

가장 심각한 문제는 우리 자녀들이 대학교에 입학하고 졸업할 때 약 90%의 학생들이 교회을 떠난다는 것입니다. 많은 교회에서, 많은 교역자들은 이 문제를 대학/청년/EM 으로 해결하려고 합니다. 하지만, 문제는 그 전에 있다는 것입니다. 교회의 주일학교에서 자란 학생들이 제대로 신앙교육을 받고 있느냐 하는 것입니다. 학생들이 성경에 대한 지식과 하나님의 대한 지식은 높아지지만 하나님을 개인적으로 알지 못한다는 것입니다. 

주일학교의...

September 8, 2010 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

Calling all EM pastors... in CRC and not.

Share some of your stories with us. I am working to help KM generation pastors to understand and to support EM and EM pastors. More stories and concerns I have, better I will be equipped to prepare them.

I am looking for your frustrations as...

August 23, 2010 0 1 comments
Discussion Topic
한인교회 목회가 어려운 이유는 무엇일까요? 여러분이 생각하시는 그 문제에 대한 대안은 어떤 것이 있겠습니까?
April 13, 2010 0 1 comments
Q&A

한글 입력이 가능하군요! Korean fonts can be accepted! We have the privilege of enjoying the SCE Learning Event on Feb. 15(Mon) at Hilton Garden Inn in San Bernardino, California. About 45 Korean pastors have registered for the event. This shows how much they desire to see healthier churches or how eager...

February 15, 2010 0 2 comments
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I wish more Korean pastors and leaders have your understanding.

Thank you for your sharing.

There are many things that can define a healthy church, but as a closer to second generation looking into first generation Korean church, here are some items to address... briefly.

1. Healthy churches requires healthy pastors. Emotionally, mentally, socially and spiritually. Churches will enjoy God's blessings of joy and peace if the pastors (especially the senior pastor) have God's peace and joy.

2. Healthy churches need Godly disciplines. History of Korean churches in US is not long. Many leaders are not well trained spiritually and biblical intellect in application is low. (There are some great spiritual leaders, elders, kwonsas and deacons but they are too few to find) Unfortunately, pastors have not trained their leaders well and many leaders don't know "how to do church" and cause problems. They need to be disciplined. The discipline often may need to start again with pastors.

3. Healthy churches need to train and develop leaders. Many leaders are not trained. Too many people have been ordained as elders, kwonsas and deacons simply because they've been attending church a long time and/or given significant offerings. Many problems in Korean churches can be overcomed by biblical and practical education.

4. Healthy churches should have Kingdom perspective. Too many Korean churches are self-contained. Theis is understandable with short history of churches and most are still in "survival" mode. It is important to know that church means "God's church" and church is beyond the local congregation - such as classis and denomination and even beyond.

5. Healthy churches will have respect and compassion for all people. This is another view of Kingdom perspective. Reaching out in love for people in different generation and cultures - globally and locally. Many Korean churches are great reaching those far away (mission) but not necessarily with those who are close (community). Starting with younger and English speaking generation maybe a good place to start.

6. Healthy churches starts at home. Spirituality (education and practice) must start at home and continue to church. A person who are not able to maintain healthy (Godly) home cannot be asked to lead a healthy church. One cannot give what one does not have.

7. Healthy churches must be the people. In many Korean churches, good and healthy churches means having many good programs but good programs do not produce healthy churches, good healthy people produce healthy churches. Programs must exist to build people. People should not be used to build programs. 

There are more things, I'm sure. I pray that these will prompt many discussions and even debates and arguments among Korean leaders. Of course, not for the sake of arguing but to build healthier churches. It is time that we retreat from all that we do and start thinking, praying and discerning what really are important among all that we do as pastors.

I believe that the goal of all EMs should be to become independent, EXCEPT in the rare case where the KM is willing to accept the EM as equal partners in ministry, with the same status and respect given to their own ministries and leadership.

I agree with you that the KM is the key to the success of an EM.  Like any parent with a child, the parent (KM) needs to care for and nuture the child (EM), but also needs to help the child grow up, let go, and become independent.  There comes a point where the parent must see the child as an independent adult with its own life, mission, and goals.  To not let them develop this way is like having a 30 year old child still living with their parents at home, without a job.

Although many EM members consider themselves to be more "American" than Korean, I still believe that the way they were raised, often in the Korean church and culture still affects their thinking and attitudes.  For example, Koreans are taught to respect their elders, bow to them whenever they are seen, and to submit to them.  This can be a positive thing, yet in terms of being independent, adult, leaders in a church, this attitude can often hinder EM members.  Because they are constantly submitting to, and being made to submit to the "elder" KM members, they often don't see themselves as adults or leaders, but rather as children.

In addition, EM members who have grown up in the Korean church their whole lives have often had many negative experiences from Korean churches (fighting between pastor/elders, etc.).  So, while, EM members submit to, and often respect the KM outwardly, many are still skeptical and pessimistic about the KM and their leadership.  They have not seen enough good examples of Gospel-filled leadership to become leaders themselves.

Therefore, starting from the top, with the EM pastor, there needs to be a sense of united leadership, not just among the EM, but with the KM as well.  The EM pastor needs to be truly equal with the KM.  Since the EM pastor cannot be seen as defiant or pushy in front of the KM, it is the KM pastor's and elders job to defend and support the EM pastor.  The EM Pastor, in turn needs a long-term plan to develop EM elders.  I've seen too many EMs that do not have adequate elder leadership and are certainly unfit to be independent.  In this context, the EM needs to grow into its own, with guidance from the KM.  Honest and open communication is key.  Clear goals should be set.

The number one thing that I would suggest regarding healthiness of churches, ESPECIALLY in Korean churches is open communication.  In Korean culture, as with many other Asian cultures, there are many cultural beliefs, ideas, and ways of thinking that are simply assumed, taken for granted, but not openly and clearly communicated.  There is also the idea of public shame, where certain embarassing things are not to be revealed in public, lest those people be judged.  Often times, in an Asian-American church, the shamed person leaves the church never to return.

These two issues are key in developing a healthy Korean church in North America.  Expectations and other thoughts need to be clearly communicated to everyone in the congregation.  Also, the church needs to foster an atmosphere of forgiveness and grace, where people are not afraid to be honest with their failures and shortcomings.  These are important in every church, of course, but even more important in Asian-American churches where everyone tends to conform to long-held, traditional beliefs that are often uncommunicated.

Sorry. My English version was rejected by the system as having a spam like quality.

Congratulations and praise God for your appointment.

I am praying that you (as well as all other delegates) will discern God's Spirit as Synod convenes. Yes, there are many important issues that needs decisions. Try to read up on other issues as well - especially the diversity report.

I have not been diligent in posting things here as I should have. 

 

이번 총회에 가신는 것에 축하드리며 격려합니다. 하나님께서 귀하게 쓰실 것으로 믿습니다. 이번에 중요한 내용들이 몇가지 있지요. 주님의 인도안에서 잘 결정하실 것을 믿고 부탁드립니다. 

앞으로 계속 post 를 올려 주시기 부탁드립니다.

My concern isn't so much about whether or not the committee were diligent in their work or if what they wrote was appropriate, but that the people, myself included, haven't seen enough explanation of the changes they made.  As I listened to a member on the committee explain their word choices I began to understand better why certain terms or phrases were used.  It would be helpful for that detailed information to be provided and the denominations be given enough time to digest it.  This is an important change and as I grow older I see the wisdom in taking our time.

Sahlom!

'10 Gkym Mission Conference is amazing event for Korean-American yousters.

Our 9 youngsters got strong challenge for their future lives.

We had a great time of their sharing from attending, they restored, challenged and decided their lives to the llOrd, and we all cried and thanked to God when we heard their testimonies, and also we pray for all participant's lives as well as the leaders of Gkym.

Praise the Lord's workings!

Thanks, Ken. Your kind words are encouraging.

It would be great to overcome all barriers and just worship together. One of these days, before we get to heaven, we can work to make it a reality.

Thanks... in Christ,

Ron

Thanks Ronald, God bless you Your reports and information about the Korean community is much appreciated. I wish the CRC would communicate better with all parts of this body of believers. I would love to go to a Korean CRC and see the work of God even if I didn't understand a word. The faces would be enough!

Thanks

Ken

Hi Ron, Thanks for the update on our Korean Brothers. Sounds like your churches need help for schools. Maybe you could setup a donation site here to help.

God bless you

Ken

GKYM Conference (Higher Calling) now has about 2000 college and young adults registered, but there are still room. At $150, which includes hotel and food, the is the best deal and blessing any where. There are over 40 workshops on missions and leadership and life. Great speakers and great music. Check out the conference website at www.gkym.org and click the US flag for English. CRWM and Leadership Exchange and Korean Ministry are participating among many others supporters such as Compassion Int'l and World Vision and numerous churches. This conference is open to all English speaking and there also is a Korean track.

 

GKYM 집회에 약 2000명의 청년들이 등록되어 있습니다. 아직도 자리가 있습니다. 3박4일을 San Diego Resort에서 모이는데 $150 (호텔과 식사 포함) 입니다. 40개 이상의 세미나도 준비가 되어있고 좋은 강사들과 은혜되는 찬양이 준비되어 있습니다. 더 자세한 내용은 www.gkym.org을 참조하세요. 우리 교단의 세계선교와 리더십 엑스체인지와 한임목회 사무실도 참여하며 여러 단체들이 후언하고 있습니다. 기도하시며 오셔서 함께 주님안에서 은혜를 나누며 축복 받으시기 바랍니다.

Hi Ronald, Is it possible to print a english version also. I would like to hear from our Korean brothers.

Good question.

Actually, many EM folks have gone to Anglo churches. Some stay but majority find themselves again unsatisfied. They feel something is missing. Many try Korean churches again after couple to few years later, but again dissatisfied and unfulfilling. 

I believe it has to do with some spirituality. Can't put into words, but these are truly marginal or between people. They are called Korean-Americans and they should be both Korean and American, but in reality they are also neither fully Korean nor American. I believe all ethnic person feel this way. They think they can be both but at the same time, they are neither. They can't explain it, they don't know what it is... only thing they know is that they are neither. 

I am a firm believer that only true satisfiable identity (where one can survive in all people and culture) is found in Christ. Unfortunately, this is what is missing in most churches. 

Ultimately, we have to link people to Christ... before anything else. Often we focus on earthly matters without leading them to spiritual. We need to start with where they are, but we must lead them to Christ. 

Some will make it in Anglo churches, which is good. Some will make it in multi-ethnic churches, which is also good. However, majority will seek to find... without knowing what they are looking for. It is this majority lost people that we have to focus and guide them to Christ and to church.

Thanks for responding. Maybe you have some other ideas and strategies to share?

Ron

No easy answer to this one.  After years working with Hispanic churches that have their own version of this difficulty,  I just have another question.  I wonder if Korean EMs integrating with Anglo EMs - in places where proximity etc. allow for it - could be a solution for some?

Lou

 

 

Ron,

If you feel like you're talking to the air, take heart -- I'm not the wind speaking, but I'm eager to see your ministry to KM and EM prosper.   As a "Korean wannabee" I'll keep you and this matter in my prayers!     Blessings....

 

posted in: EM forum

 한인 목회가 특별히 어려운 것일까요? 목회라는 것이 힘든것이 아닌가요? 특별히 인간의 힘으로 감당하려면 힘든것 뿐 아니라 불가능한것이 아닐까요? 제가 섬겼던 교회를 생각해 봅니다. 매우 갈등이 심각한 교회였지요. 언제나 목사와 장로들 사이에 갈등이 많지요. 많은 한인교회에 같은 문제인것 같습니다.

하나님께서 하나 가르쳐주신 것이 있습니다. 하나님은 한분 이십니다. 목사가 섬기는 분은 하나님... 장로들이 믿는 분도 하나님... 같은 하나님을 섬긴다면, 목사와 장로사이에 갈등이 있을수 있을까요? 그럴수는 없겠지요. 한분이신 하나님이 목사에게 이런말을 주시고 장로에게 저런말을 주시지 않을것입니다. 그러면 왜 갈등이 생기고 싸움이 생기고 전쟁이 나는가를 생각해 보며 기도했습니다. 조용하게 하나님꼐서 주신 말씀은... 목사가 이기적인 생각을 하고 있던가... 아니면 장로가 이기적인 생각을 하고 있던지... 한쪽 아니면 양쪽이 하나님의 중심이 아니라는 것입니다. 제가 담임목사로 섬기던 교회에서도 논쟁이 되고 분쟁이 될수 있었던 때가 있었습니다. 하지만 하나님께서 주신 생각을 장로들과 나누며 우리 (저와 당회원들)의 마음을 정말로 비우고 기도하며 하나님의 뜻을 구할 때, 하나님의 역사를 체험했습니다. 정말로 기적적으로 당회가 하나가 되는 것을 보게되었습니다. 한달이 걸릴때가 있었고 두달이 걸릴때도 있었습니다. 하지만, 살아계신 하나님의 역사를 보게 되었습니다. 

다른 여러가지 어려운 일등이 있겠지만, 그중에 한가지를 나누어 봅니다.

제가 떠날때 처음으로 담임목사가 축복을 받고 나왔습니다. 지금도 사랑과 축복의 기도를 받고 있습니다. 제가 잘한것이 아니고, 하나님의 지혜를 깨닫고 믿고 따를때 역사가 일어났다는 간증을 드립니다. 

많은 한인교회가 많은 아픔과 고통을 가지고 갈라지는 모습을 봅니다. 우리 목사들과 장로들이 (먼저 목사들이) 자기 생각을 버리고 한분이신 하나님을 장로들과 함께 섬긴다면, 감사와 사랑과 축복이 넘치는 교회를 세울수 있지 않을까... 기도해 봅니다.

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