Discussion Topic

       " No issue in missiology is more important, more difficult, more controversial, or more divisive for the days ahead than the theology of religions.
This is the arena where differing truth claims among world religions challenge Christians to articulate their understanding of the...

March 2, 2014 0 0 comments
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What does it mean to be a responsible global citizen?
February 20, 2014 0 0 comments
Discussion Topic

New Film From the Heart of Guatemala City

Through Christian Reformed World Missions (CRWM) and CRWM missionary Joel Van Dyke, the CRCNA supports Guatemalan leaders seeking to share Jesus' love and grace with at-risk youth in Guatemala City. In 2010 the film production company ...

February 19, 2014 0 0 comments
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Recently Mary Dykstra (Global Volunteer Coordinator for World Renew) and I (Wendy) were interviewed for the Transformational Networks blog by Bethany Beachum (Nehemiah Center). Below is an excerpt of that interview. I invite your questions on the topic of global volunteers and partnership.
February 11, 2014 0 0 comments
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One of the kindest signs of community that we as a family have experienced in our Neland CRC congregation is the way the whole faith family contributes to an educational fund that helps parents meet the heavy tuition load while their kids are in school. In a similar way, I witnessed in November how the “Love Cambodia” congregation, one of World Renew’s local partners, blesses their surrounding communities. 
February 4, 2014 0 0 comments
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Watching Downton Abbey has become a worldwide phenomenon. Lots of diverse people have become invested in the fortunes of the Crawleys: upstairs and downstairs. It occurs to me that one of the fundamental story lines in that series has important parallels to the future of Christian Reformed World Missions...
January 28, 2014 0 20 comments
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In the mid 2000’s Christianity Today took notice of research by Calvin College Professor, Kurt Ver Beek, on the lower than expected benefits of sending volunteers out from North America. Ver Beek has lived in Honduras for 30 years and he was there for the duration of Hurricane Mitch (which took 14,000 lives in 1998). The North Americans who flew south to serve in the aftermath of the storm were his case study.
January 21, 2014 0 4 comments
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In the world of missions, disaster response, and community development, there are a lot of organizations. A LOT. World Renew works in partnership with a lot of them. 
January 14, 2014 0 2 comments
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In the spirit of the 12 days of Christmas, I challenged myself to think of 12 reasons to love Muslims. Here goes and we will see if I can do it.
January 6, 2014 0 20 comments
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10. Getting Involved in Global MissionsThis post definitely has staying power! Written in 2009, it provides a comprehensive list of ways to get involved in missions, overseas and in North America. You'll also find links to helpful resources.
December 31, 2013 0 2 comments
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Why not start the New Year with a fresh slate when it comes to promoting your missionaries? If it's been awhile since your church updated its website or newsletter listings, now is a great time to make sure everything is still accurate. If you have done this recently, why not use the checklist below to consider additional ways in which you might let your congregation know about the missionaries they support?
December 17, 2013 0 0 comments
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In his book, Journeys of the Muslim Nation and the Christian Church, David Shenk describes three meetings experienced by a Christian college group in Israel and the West Bank.“First, they met with a Hamas leader. He explained the theology of Islamic jihad. He stated that in the present circumstances violent confrontation with Israel was the only alternative, that jihad was necessary.
December 10, 2013 0 2 comments
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Advent is upon us. The lands of Israel, Assyria, and Egypt were the lands where Jesus was born, was a refugee, and did identify as his home. As we remember his first coming, and watch these countries come into and out of the news, let us not forget to pray for them.
December 3, 2013 0 0 comments
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"Friends, this world is not your home, so don’t make yourselves cozy in it." 1 Peter 2:11 (The Message)
November 21, 2013 0 0 comments
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Joel Hogan worked as a Christian Reformed World Missions missionary for seven years in Tacloban, a city of about 200,000 people on Leyte island, which was in the eye of  Typhoon Haiyan that hit the Philippines last Friday. In fact, he lived on a road leading from a Christian Reformed Church in the Philippines (CRCP) congregation near the water and the airport. 
November 14, 2013 0 0 comments
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People tend to fear what they don't know. Knowledge reduces fear and allows people to take a step of faith and engage the stranger in their midst. Many Muslims have immigrated to North America and have become our neighbors. Do you have a basic understanding about what Muslims actually believe or practice? And where would you start to witness to your faith...
November 12, 2013 0 14 comments
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I walked out of the train station and heard the familiar strains of French and English being spoken, sometimes both languages used interchangeably. Montreal has a large population of Muslims and our denomination is committed to reaching out to Muslims.
November 7, 2013 0 1 comments
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Last weekend I had the privilege of meeting with representatives from five churches currently involved in global partnerships through World Renew, five churches that are thinking about getting involved, and seven international staff. It was amazing to hear about what God is doing in the various churches here in North America and in churches overseas. What diversity!
October 15, 2013 0 2 comments
Discussion Topic

"Exploring Cultural Intelligence" will be presented by Pennylyn Dykstra-Pruim (designer and facilitator of the “Building Your Cultural Intelligence” workshop) on October 30. This free, one-hour webinar will outline the key skill areas of cultural intelligence and explore how Cultural...

October 8, 2013 0 0 comments
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SEC volunteer coordinator “Jan” (we can’t use her real name because she is currently serving in a closed country) launched the Skype club concept in March 2012, and has already started 12 international clubs. Hundreds of international English language learners are asking to be included in a Spotlight English Club. “We are limited only by the lack of volunteers available to lead these Skype clubs,” Jan says.And that’s one reason she is requesting what she calls “couch potato ministry volunteers.”
October 8, 2013 0 0 comments
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“With the erosion of organizational loyalty, many see dwindling motivation for younger generations to support missions unless a direct connection between church and missionary can be established. Detachment, even distrust, describes younger generations’ attitudes about institutions, and it becomes evident in the offering plate. Donors want to know ‘how my money is being spent.’ Motivation for giving seems to be shifting. These factors will make it increasingly difficult for denominations to fund missionary salaries from large pooled accounts.”
October 1, 2013 0 2 comments
Discussion Topic

This article in the online Banner caught my attention: Leadership The Color of Love. 

The author writes, "How does a church balance the call to minister locally and at the same time not neglect the Great Commission’s mandate to go to the ends of the earth? In our church the answer lies...

September 30, 2013 0 1 comments
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World Renew believes that God calls Christians everywhere to love their neighbors and to care for those in need. As many North Americans have discovered, when they respond to this call they are as blessed as those they serve. By working through local churches to equip Christians like Yan, they experience the blessing of serving others.
September 24, 2013 0 0 comments
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As we share the hope we have (1 Peter 3:15), we have to speak of more than sin; we have to speak about shame. After recently preaching on this subject in a church in Canada, I was struck that I had hit a cord with my listeners. We in the West are also struggling with shame. Anyone who has struggled with a mental illness, or the family members of such a person, has dealt with shame. Recent cases in the news of cyber bullying have led to suicides due to shame. To live in the shadow of suicide is to live with shame. A Professor commented that young people are leaving the church because they have issues with shame that the church is not addressing.
September 17, 2013 0 3 comments
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With the start of a new school year, your mission committee might be looking for some new and interesting ways to promote missions within your congregation. In addition to the excellent missions education resources available from Christian Reformed World Missions, you may want to check out the following websites.
September 10, 2013 0 1 comments

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I support the concept that OUR missionaries should be 100% supported by Synod. At the least, "A deal's a deal." If a missionary is not doing his part, fire him for cause. If the missionary is doing his part . . . how is Synod's unilaterially changing contracts in mid stream different than companies that are scrapping pension plans for senior employees? 

The financial condition of CRWM and CRWRC must be at least five years old. So how many new missionaries have been put on the payroll in the last 3 years? Just curious. CRC's strong point is theology. Our weak point is business management.

At least half of most every church budget goes to making the members feel good and/or to increase  the take aka membership. In 60 years of church going, I only know of one congregation - NOT Reformed - that gave 50% of their budget to missionaries and have heard they have gone main stream. I am sure that every one of you knows of a local congregation that is not paying its Synodical membership dues - call them what you want - because the congregation is paying for, even borrowing for, a cosmetic or building expansion building project. 

Recently read that there are 5 billion people in the world who live on $2/day or less. If every Christian in the US and Canada sold everything they owned and gave it to CRWM and other charity organizations, would there be enough to help those 5 billion people temporarially live on $3/day?

I remember in the 1950's hearing commercials for "Save The Children" and such. These are BIG national charities. If these charities were successful one might expect that by now there should be enough "saved" children who are thankful enough to make the charities self-propagating. Same with "Habitat." Apparently saving bodies is not more successful than the last 2,000 years of saving souls.

Not saying that we should not help people where and when we can if the Holy Spirit leads us to help a specific missionary or other person.  Personally, at least half the time I have tried to personally help one of my neighbors, their situation got worse. Does the Bible "say" anything about "sending good money after bad?"

 

Your forum cynic,

bill

 

Granted - a smaller mission force is not what we want - neither is a model where missionaries have to be salesmen better than the staff in GR, attempting to raise ministry shares! Financing local missionaries in foreign countries is another model, having staff in GR paid on the same basis as missionaries - raise your own funds - then come to work - is another model to use.  A shrinking money pot is what all of us have to face - why use the services of front line staff - the ones that actually bring the WORD to others - to raise money may not be the solution everyone is looking for. Missionaries can now shop around for the best deal, since many missionary organizations use the same model. Since there is only so much CRC based money around, who can prove more money will flow into CRC related organizations using this model? 

Are we merely competing for the same pot among ourselves?

Steve, I too have not seen the program but your comparison is interesting. The issue of CRWM is an issue for the CRCNA . We need to look at the whole and just not at each piece. The pillars (some would call them silos) are no longer the supporting the whole structure or mission. And I believe the foundations of the pillars need reform as well. 

I believe were are internalizing the process of the review and might be better served if we looked outside the religious establishment for some options. Just an idea.

Posting on behalf of John Rustenburg:

Very well stated with the harsh realities of our affluent times....and that is a very sad reality, namely, we are not a "poor denomination", but I believe that the emphasis on where even Christians spend their incomes is largely on self ,and kingdom causes no longer or seldom have priority as they might have been in previous times.

Regretfully we seldom hear from our pulpits the Bible standards for spending: that Christ's kingdom work must come first.When I see the wealth among God's people (homes,vehicles,earthly possesions, vacations with global emphasis, sports,eating out, and the list could go on.) When will we again hear the warnings of Deut. 6 & 8 that God gave to His people before they became wealthy in the promised land as well as the clarion observation of our Saviour in Revelation to the Ephesian church: "you've lost your first love".

   John

Hi Ken,  In other settings the word has gone out (not with complete accuracy!) that CRWM career missionaries will need to broaden and deepen their support networks.  Until now CRWM has relied heavily on Ministry Share to make budgets work.  The point of the analogy is that this reliance hasn't worked well in recent decades and other sources of revenue are essential to a growing ministry.  That is true even if it requires us to change cherished methods.

How important are career missionaries to that growing ministry?  Very.  In places where there are substantial numbers of Christians (the "reached" world) the main thing that CRWM does is provide training to those national Christians, who are the most important piece of the mission effort.  However, more than one-fourth of the world's people live among unreached people groups, where there are few or no Christians.  Even in such settings we "begin with the end in mind" by seeking to develop leadership abilities in those who have come to faith, knowing that we will not be there forever. CRWM seeks to respond to the varied conditions in various places and among various peoples.  

Well stated. An interesting anology. Maybe "The benevolent role of the World Missions board toward its missionaries (that) has been a touchstone of that relationship" is the primary teaching for the CRC supporting congregations and for the people we try to help. Must a smaller mission force result in a smaller impact on our world for Christ? Isn't that up to the Holy Spirit to decide?  

Probably wrong, but I think the next 50 years in North America will see an economic/social structure similar to that described in Downton Abbey but without the benevolent ownership/leadership. The Gini Index will grow while the poor and the working class retains all our "rights" as defined by our constitutions and case law.

 

 

Interesting comparison!  I don't have cable, so I don't know the story of Downton Abbey.  What I'm left wondering, however, at the end of your comparison is: What new means of fundraising do we need to employ?  What are some examples of funding that we must consider to stay in business and to keep the mission going?

Secondly, I wonder if the lower number of career missionaries isn't a good thing.  Might that be because we now realize that for real mission to have power and impact in the local community, it must be done by locals?  So rather than having career missionary families on the scene, isn't it better if someone from the West goes occasionally to train the locals, and then returns to the West leaving the national to carry on the ministry?

Hey JP I don't know where your comments went, perhaps they were flagged for moderation - considered too sarcastic. At any rate it is only through honest discussion that we will find common ground in our approach to Islam. This debate has been going on at least since the 19th century evangelical missionary movement. We have different approaches but the Spirit of God leads us and Lord willing Jesus will be glorified. Whether you take a more contextual or historic approach, that is our end goal. I advocate a respectful stance towards Islam as an important part of that process.

And the CRC wonders why so many members are leaving the denomination.

I'm pleased to hear of the "Justice and Excellence in Short Term Missions Think Tank."  I think its high time we consider seriously what we are trying to accomplish with short term missions.  Often such trips when considered thoughtfully will end up doing more harm than good.  I would refer the reader to a book by Brian Fikkert with the title: "When Helping Hurts."  When short term missions sends teams to go and do what the locals should be doing for themselves, that form of helping hurts the locals and creates unhealthy dependeny.  I trust that the "Justice and Excellence in Short Term Missions Think Tank" will give some much needed guidance in this area. 

Thanks Daniel. That makes sense. I agree that it is all about relationships in the real world.

I am glad this think tank has been formed. Too often I have seen money raised for short-term mission trips that clearly were not going to benefit either the travellers or the folks in the destination country.  I still remember meeting a Haitian pastor who, suggested that just maybe Haiti would be better off if North America would "just leave us alone."  

That being said, it may be that there is still room for overseas short term missions "done right." For example, one of the focuses of a well-done short term mission trip might be education--learning about other cultures, learning about how our actions in North America have a major impact around the work, etc. I had an experience like this in college during a two-week "mission trip" to the Dominican Republic, where we spent much of our time either learning in a classroom type setting or learning by spending time connecting with the folks in the DR. Yes, we did some painting and some digging, and taught a VBS in a batey, and I don't pretend that our trip was some paragon to be admired or copied, but the focus really was on learning from and connecting with Dominican and Haitian Christians, and it seems there were at least some long-term benefits. 

I don't pretend to have any answers on how we should be doing short-term mission; best wishes to the folks involved in the think tank--I suspect they will make conclusions that will be both challenging and beneficial.

I am not a language scholar - but I've heard that the word "go" could be translated "as you are going". We don't need to go far away to have cross-cultural and soul transforming experiences. They are all around us "as we are going". There are homeless shelters, places where street people gather, domestic violence shelters, community centers, all kinds of support groups, migrant workers, home health aides, our neighbors, store clerks, etc. I hope that the Excellence and Justice in Short Term Missions Think Tank will think of these opportunities as well.

OK the distinction I am making is moving away from apolegetics ( using your term now) to being relational & what it means to be a neighbor. The House example.  have experienced aploegtics as mere conversations amongst Christians themselves and not that engaging in the real world. However, being a good neighbor (with all its complexities) in the REAL world does allow for greater interaction amongst people of various faiths. That's all.

Hi Daniel,

I agree that first questions are crucial, and with help of the HS and apologetics we can encourage the asking of such questions. Not sure where you are going with your example of the painted house. Now I am curious, could you explain your point a little more?

Thanks.

Thank you for commenting, Larry! I have very similar sentiments about the Banner articles. What helps me is to take an asset based/appreciative inquiry approach (it works in the field, why not with our churches?)

I focus on the heart that is behind supporting those organizations. I am sure that their intentions are good. And, not everyone wants to learn about good development/missional practices. It is my job to serve those who do.

Hopefully the Global Missions Network and other communications that come from our agencies will reach those whom they are meant to reach.

Excellent question Wendy and one that I believe is not asked enough when churches or our church members get excited about a mission or ministry and want to support that organization. I personally know people that supported a mission for years before they began to realize the paternalistic tendencies this mission had and ended their support.  

Why is it some people are so quick to give to an organization without understanding how the organization works and what they do, or don’t do. I think perhaps that our mission agencies have done a poor job of explaining what good development looks like? Or perhaps poor development and poor missions has been going on for so long people just assume this is the way it should happen.

I think the bigger concern is when CRC congregations go off on their own and start their own international ministries with little to no knowledge of what they are getting themselves into. I have seen stories in our denominational publication of churches that have gone to countries around the world to build schools or churches or houses for pastors or children’s homes. While they may have perfectly good intentions generally they do not follow good development practices and are probably creating more harm than good. I know some of these CRC congregation supported missions are in countries where WR or CRWM have had a presence for years and yet they are not consulted about the project.

I am glad to hear you do receive inquires from people and churches about different organizations. As churches start to look beyond their neighbourhoods and extend their mission focus globally it will be good for them to understand these characteristics and ask these types of questions will be important for them to ask before they act. I think it is also important for our denomination to have a clear sense of what good development and mission work is. If CRC congregation supported missions with little to no thought about good development practices are highlighted in the Banner, somewhere there is a disconnect.

It was, I beleive, Bishop Newbigin who pointed out to me that when we examine the gospel writingss; all "so called gospel presentations" are actually responses made to questions FIRST asked. Jose puts his finger on sometgng crucial at the end. That to me, is the key approach.

It is our genuine & authentic relations with Muslims in all other areas of life (not a narrowed focus on just the spiritual or figuring whose God is right, etc) that the HS works so they can ask questions of us. Without the first, the second may not take place.Then only do we have some reason to share "spritually." Moreover, it might mean some Muslims would have to remain anonymous. 

Let me illustrate. In a rather wealthy neighborhood, I was approached by a family stating some in the neighborhood were alarmed that a Muslim doctor had painted his house in rather bright colors. I took a walk to see the place and she was right. It did stand out from the rest. She asked for my advice.  Rather than give it here; maybe this can be a case-study for thoughtful people to interact over how they would handle it. 

 

Just saying....

 

one grows weary of modern ideas of incusivism and acceptance. the danger of it is that without proper instruction and or explanation, too many Christians are being confused at to where do we draw the line.

loving our neighbors, loving our enemies and praying for those who persevute us is a commandment. The Bible teaches us that if we do not love our neighbors who we can see we cannot say that we love God whom we've never seen. but that same chapter of 1 John 4 tells us that anyone who denies Jesus as the son of God is not from God, it goes further to say that whose who deny Jesus have the spirit of the antichrist.

what I get from this is that the god the Muslims worship is not our God, and we must pray hard for them and LOVINGLY lead then to the truth. the fact that they recognize Jesus as a great prophet can hardly be used as an argument when those who acknowledge Jesus as the son of God are called Blasphemers by muslims, and, in their believes,  are deserving of death.

I have plenty of muslim friends, and touching religious issues with them is very complicated, only when they ask questions do I answer, and because they see me as an infidel, there is very little I can say which gets acknowledged by them. Bottom line is, only prayer anf letting the Holy Spirit touch those God has separated for Himself can do the Job. Beware that we do not turn against God trying to get too cozy with the enemies of God!

 

Greg:

This relational aspect needs to be expounded further. The family home; bought in 1949 was a former British Bungalow. India gained independence in 1947. We finally sold it in 1991 to a Muslim family and my spinster aunt moved in to "Husaainabad" a Muslim condo a few blocks away. Our home was sold to Mr. Khan. on the condition that he would not demolize it. Every other Bungalow in our neigborhood had been bought up and high-rise condos were built; the land being more valuable than the Bungalows themselves. Our home still stands to this day; Mr Khan kept his promise; even though he (and actually my aunt initially) could have made a lot more money. Each family invites and attends important events in our lives.

My point. We need to define relational; it involves being a genuine neighbor, doing proper business transtactions, sharing what we have with those who do not, engaging in social ativities, etc. This issue of love & fear (a rather western constract) needs to be translated into real relational terms. Will someone sell or buy a house from a Muslim here in N. America? (I have a rather different version about Islam -as a system- and its desire for world dominion; without a cross; but not in this discource).  It gets down to getting dirt under our finger nails; so to speak ; in our own neigborhoods.  

One of my favorite shows is "Little Mosque" on the PIVOT Channel. Great funny comedy of interactiins between Muslims & Christians in Canada. Brilliant show. 

 

Just sharing....

 

For a biblical basis for viewing all persons as children of God see www.evangelicalinclusivism.com, Postings 1, 2, 3 and 4.

Thanks Daniel for the testimony of your grandfather and for pointing out that relationships are key for engaging with people of other faiths and witnessing to our faith.

I have never been a fan of comparative religious studies or conversations; be it the liberal version that tries to share common ground or the fconservative versions that tend to be polemic. I always felt this is dangerous territory for the average Christian to tread and rather unecessary. I wish to highlight the relational aspect that can be distilled from this 12 step program, Just a joke; along the way. 

Speaking as one who grew up with his window facing the mosque and the "call to worship" my morning rooster and a neighborhood to this day mostly Muslim; I was visting it several decades later. I saw a man sitting on the ground in the front of the mosque. You could spit across the street into my room. I told him I grew up across at that home. This old man lept up to his feet and asked me who Dr. Devaputra was. I answered "he was my grand-father." He bowed down (imagine an older man) and thanked ME for what my grand-father did for myriads of Muslim students; since he was an educator. In fact, he was the first Christian to obtain a PhD (in our city) and that would have been in the late 1920's. This old man spoke how my grand-dad would tutor the local children; and he was one of them. He refused to let me go!!!!!

I think most Christians GET that  ultimately it is relational and contributing your own gifts and talents to others; whoever they might be. 

 

 

Thanks for a very balanced listing, including items 7and 12, which clearly indicate that loving Muslims includes witness to the truth about Jesus.

Thank you for all of your responses to this post. It is good to discuss these issues. I want to respond specifically to Elizabeth because this is a question that I often receive in seminars. Can you tell me which specific verse (Sura, ayat) you are referring to in the Quran? It would help me in formulating an answer. Thanks.

 

 

 

Thanks for this Greg!  What I appreciated the most about your '12 reasons' was your reminder for us to think of ways God is already at work in those we meet, including Muslims.   

Isn't it great that the triune God is always at work in this world ahead of us and if we are willing, offers us daily opportunities to share with others our unique relationship with God that has come to us through Jesus with those we meet!  

You have done us a favour by reminding us of some common human bridges that if we are wise enough to recognize them as we interact with Muslims will enable us to become more effective witnesses for the living Jesus. 

 

Danielle:   With respect to Islam "being a religion"  I was also of that understanding at one time,  but found that  Barnhardt's use of the  word 'masquerade'  (refer to Hebrews 4:12,13) made the correct distinction i.e. Islam is a politcal system masquerading as a religion.

Thanks for this, Greg! I find that I can talk openly about God and find common ground much more easily with my Muslim friends than with my secular ones. 

In response to Barnhardt's comments on Islam, Islam is most definitely a religion, but it operates without the separation of church and state that we're so used to and which is a pretty recent invention in the West. 

We are to love Muslims yes - by earnestly praying for the Holy Spirit to enable them to come to saving faith in Christ.  The Qur'an or holy book of Islam emphatically rejects the divinity of Jesus and  his death and resurrection - the very heart of the gospel. The Qur'an brands the Christian worship of Jesus as the Son of God blasphemous. As to the Muslim who had to stop the car for prayer time, one may wonder whether it was devotion or legalism that is, a strict obedience to Islam. The Pharisees strictly sought to observe the Law of Moses and as for me, when a Roman Catholic I never missed Sunday Mass. And it wasn't always genuine devotion. It was primarily because I believed it was a mortal sin deserving of hell punishment unless forgiveness is obtained, normally through the confessional booth at church. 

Greg...........AMEN to all 12 statements!..............Dean Koldenhoven

Recently I read in the Qur'an that the Muslim's duty in obeying Allah, they are to annihilate the people of the Book.  I take it that the people of the Book are Christians who love their Bible.  Can you help me understand the language in the Qur'an.

Thank you for sharing this wonderfully Biblical piece, Greg! Well said.

Thanks Ben! I fixed it. Too many Joels over there at World Missions ;-)

Hi Wendy,

#3 on the list "Can We Be Friends?" was written by Joel Huyser, not Joel Hogan.  I worked with Joel Huyser and Darryl Mortensen in Nicaragua and consider them both as friends til this day!

Thanks,

Ben Meyer

Thanks for this, Greg.  What he (or you) say about the importance of power in Muslim culture jibes with what we experienced working among Muslims in West Africa.  Power and success (e.g. wealth) met with automatic respect and was considered a sign of God's blessing, no matter how (often illegitimately) the power and success were achieved.  Likewise, suffering and poverty were disrespected and considered a sign of God's disfavor, even if the suffering was for a just cause (for being honest, for example).  

    It's so important for Christians not to respond to violence with violence, but rather to go the way of the Cross.  This also reminds me of N.T. Wright's argument in "How God Became King" that it was precisely in Jesus' death in weakness on the Cross that he defeated Satan and became King.

Thanks for the article Greg. This kind of information helps me to better understand the Muslim faith in todays world and how christians should respond. The Egyptian christians (as other presecuted christians in the world today) must be recieving special strength from God to practise forgiveness as has been described. We will continue to pray for them.

Thanks for  your input Greg.   There is absolutely no need for you to be sorry.  As you correctly concluded, "Ami" is given as  a pseudonym. The author (whoever he is) likes to be assured he can rest at night in his own bed,  unlike Geert Wilders who, for his own safety  has to sleep in a jail cell when in his home country.

Nevertheless, "Ami's" book was written in 2007, is registered as ISBN 0-9781206-0-4 and I think  represents the positons of both faiths, Muslim and Christian in an unbiased manner.

As for Wild Bill, he is a colorful character but no one, or any one group, has sued Wild Bill for libel nor are any suits pending.    Secondly, Bill is known to be a strong and discerning Christian....not afraid to separate fact from fiction.   North America needs more men with similar backbone, present respondents excepted of course.

Thankfully my Christian faith does not preclude me from reaching out to people of all persuasians, including Muslims.  I appreciate your concern in that regard.

    Your 2 sources of 'Truth' Ed are most interesting. I am sorry, but obviously there is no such person as Ami Ben-Chanan. I suppose it was a play on words from the Jewish musician, Chanan Benami. And to cite 'WildBillfor America', obviously he has an agenda that doesn't include truth as a priority. Just as I wouldn't seek truth about civil rights from a white supremist, we should be so very careful who we trust to guide us, our Pastor's included. In times such as there we can be so easily lead astray. I pray that your Christian faith doesn't preclude you from reaching out & trying to love our Muslim neighbors. 

Why do you prefer the King James version of the Bible?   And can I ask what is your favorite verse in the new testament? 

 I picked up a book in Toronto some time ago written by Ami Ben-Chanan wherein the author compares the Quran and the Bible.  His hope is that the reader will understand the origins of these Books and find theTruth contained in its pages. (Quran-Bible..Comparison).  The book was distributed at a gathering of people honoring the Dutch parliamentarian Geert Wilders who is solely responsible for rolling back some earlier decisions that allowed Muslim culture to  thrive  alongside Dutch traditions.  To keep his head attached to his shoulders Geert required the protection  of 9 security people including 4 RCMP officers,

Many folks who confess to believe the Bible  have only a vague understanding of the Truth contained between the pages of Scripture.   I would encourage a thorough study of the Truth in Scripture first before picking up the Quran.

With respect to Truth, check out the website of : WildBillforAmerica,   who provides some insights into the practices of the  Islam faith, as follows: (direct quotes)

-Islam is committed to brutally eliminating all who do not worship Allah

-Sharia Law does not permit Muslims to befriend Christians or Jews

-Muslims in the Middle East live under horrible oppression

-The Muslim community is shamefully silent about Muslim attacks

-In those countries where the Muslim population is greater than 6%, violence skyrockets.  France, Spain, Norway, Sweden, the Philipines are some examples

-wherever  Islam sprouts, violence and bloodshed follow.

As Christians we are encouraged to spread the love of Jesus Christ  to all peoples, which include Muslims.   However, in order to witness effectively it is wise to first understand the mindset/culture/faith of the people being witnessed to.

 

Those attending were primarily working with World Renew for their partnerships, although it is common for their partnerships to include both World Renew and CRWM components.

Webinars can be found at www. crcna.org/webinars under the "archived" tab.

 

I am glad Ruth that you are having talks with your two Muslim friends. It sounds like you have a good relationship with them. Both the incarnation and the Trinity are major stumbling blocks for Muslims. But keep at it. There is no magic solution. If you are honest about your faith and are interested in their faith, and care about them, doors will open. These things take time. Sometimes God intervenes in miraculous ways and provides dreams and visions. But generally it is all about being good friends and modeling what life as a follower of Jesus is all about.

Webinars are archived and can be accessed after their viewing date - so you will still be able to listen to the webinar.

I have 2 muslims living in my home.  I have grown to love them greatly!  They are quiet, fun-loving, respectful young men.  I have recently attended a mosque with one of them.  He wants to convert me.  I would love to understand more deeply what they believe.  We have had some conversations, but they can't get beyond Jesus being God and the Trinity.  How do you get beyond these topics?  I would love to listen to your webinar, but am unable to due to my work schedule.  Is there an on demand version? Or is there some other way to get the information you will discuss?

 

Ruth Lamour

 

Yes, I am a regular reader of the Bible-- I prefer the King James Version. Respect for all. 

Yes, I am a regular reader of the Bible -- I prefer the King James Version. 

Shawn, are you a muslim now, and would you read the new testament of the bible? 

Been Muslim for 20 years -- ask me anything. Nothing is taboo

Greg Sinclair's statements are in keeping with the words of Jesus when He stated; "Love God...Love your neighbor!"  May God bless you Greg in your work with the Muslims and Christians!                                        

I am surprised by some of the negative comments that are posted! By the way....Sharia Law will not be the Law in the U.S.A. The Constitution of the U.S. is THE Law! There are some "peoples of culture", that may want to be ruled by a different law, but that does not matter. Only the Constitution matters!

If there are people that consider the Muslims as their enemy, Jesus had a back-up plan for that...He said; "Love your enemies!"

I l love the Muslim people! We have great dialogue with each other concerning our faith. We work together on different projects together with Trinity Christian College students and Muslim students and adults.

If a Christian is unsure of their own faith, then maybe you shouldn't have dialogue with the Muslims!

Keep the Faith Greg!                  Dean Koldenhoven Palos Heights, IL    Member of PH CRC

   No disrespect to Ed, but I'll defer to Greg's take on this subject. Greg ends his post with "What questions do you have...". Seems like Ed has his answers already, but as for me - lots of questions! I will register for the webinar now.

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