All that I meant by referring to the parable of the good Samaritan is that Just as the priest and Levite must have had "good" reasons not to give practical help to the one robbed so it seems we are finding " good reasons" why a temporary ban on certain refugees is acceptable. But Jesus did not see it that way. He asked which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell among robbers? The expert in the law said "the one who had mercy on him" Jesus told him "Go and do likewise"
Perhaps I'm wrong. You might be a good samaritan every day of your life but why can you not be a good samaritan toward Syrian refugees right now. Is there ever a time someone in trouble is not our neighbor?
Number wise the crcna would certainly be better off if she had not debated women in office for 25 years. The result was a kind of compromise that said both ways of interpretation of God's word were appropriate. However the compromise did not work. We ended up with the URC with nearly 20,000 give or take leaving the CRC. It would have been hard not to talk about it since each year we elect new elders and deacons.
If I hear you correctly you imply that there were other divisive positions the CRCNA has taken. May I ask what they were: capital punishment, abortion, marriage and divorce, peace and war,maybe I'm overlooking theone(s) you are thinking about. Help me out here, Ed.
I'll try to answer your questions in the order they appear in your post.
1. Ruthless capitalism is capitalism that violates the 8th commandment as defined by Lord's day 42 of the H.C.
2. Materialism is the kind of materialism that precludes people from heaven because their first love is money rather than Jesus.
3. Irresponsible socialism is a socialism that ignores loving your neighbor as yourself, "working faithfully so that I may share with those in need." Q&A 111 0f H.C. It also violates the sixth commandment as described by the H.C Lord's Day 40.
4. I think that the pulpit should never bully except through the power of the preached word. It may make me uncomfortable but then I need to ask is it my defiance of the Word or my obedience to God's word at bottom of this.
I'm now 72 and a retired CRCNA pastor. Early in my career I would come up against the suggestion that I should consider going RCA since that had a better retirement plan for pastors. Of course I never considered doing that but It made me question if the defined pension plan we have is better than the RCA contribution plan. I really never pursued this then nor do I want to now. Our younger pastors however have much more of a stake in this than I. I hope they respond.
Very Good Matthew. While it may not be appropriate or wise to allow immigration and refugee conversation in the pulpit we need to also affirm that it is not illegal nor should other evangelical Christians have to carry the water while CRC clergy play it cool. Many evangelical pastors have spoken against the present ban on certain immigrants and refugees. Imagine how the story of Ruth in the bible would be changed if Israel had a ban on refugees and immigrants especially the Moabites.
It sounds to me like Doug, John, and others would approve, like the church in Germany once did when they refused to speak up against Hitler, of such ethical issues as slavery, apartheid, racism, sexism. I do not buy it. Do you really mean the institutional church has no obligation to officially speak out against such evils?
Your easy distinction between individual Christians and the church as institute is tidy but it denies the church of being salt and light in the real world of evil. If fellow Christians cannot accept speaking out against such evils I suggest they should take it up with God.
You have greatly relieved my mind. I thought you and the others did not want me or others to preach or teach that a ban on Syrian Refugees was unbiblical. Now I understand you as saying the institutional church may preach against all things that are contrary to scripture such as banning refugees, immigrants, racism, sexism, ruthless capitalism, irresponsible socialism, materialism etc. So we agree ministers in the CRCNA must preach the Word of God on all these matters and let the chips fall where they may.
The verses that I am holding on to is : "Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority, and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death. For he has put everything under his feet. Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all." (1 Corinthians 15: 24-28)
In light of God's victory, political victories lose their appeal and importance.
I am privileged to be engaged in God's kingdom and victory by his grace.
Timely post and one that deals with my family and church member relations. We have made party loyalty more important than our unity in Christ. Statements like"I cannot see how a Christian could vote for Trump or Clinton" are too abundant and thoughtful and caring dialogue are too rare.
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
All that I meant by referring to the parable of the good Samaritan is that Just as the priest and Levite must have had "good" reasons not to give practical help to the one robbed so it seems we are finding " good reasons" why a temporary ban on certain refugees is acceptable. But Jesus did not see it that way. He asked which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell among robbers? The expert in the law said "the one who had mercy on him" Jesus told him "Go and do likewise"
Perhaps I'm wrong. You might be a good samaritan every day of your life but why can you not be a good samaritan toward Syrian refugees right now. Is there ever a time someone in trouble is not our neighbor?
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
I want to thank everyone who has expressed themselves on this topic, especially Matthew for starting it.
Larry
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
Number wise the crcna would certainly be better off if she had not debated women in office for 25 years. The result was a kind of compromise that said both ways of interpretation of God's word were appropriate. However the compromise did not work. We ended up with the URC with nearly 20,000 give or take leaving the CRC. It would have been hard not to talk about it since each year we elect new elders and deacons.
If I hear you correctly you imply that there were other divisive positions the CRCNA has taken. May I ask what they were: capital punishment, abortion, marriage and divorce, peace and war,maybe I'm overlooking theone(s) you are thinking about. Help me out here, Ed.
Thanks
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
Dear Ed,
I'll try to answer your questions in the order they appear in your post.
1. Ruthless capitalism is capitalism that violates the 8th commandment as defined by Lord's day 42 of the H.C.
2. Materialism is the kind of materialism that precludes people from heaven because their first love is money rather than Jesus.
3. Irresponsible socialism is a socialism that ignores loving your neighbor as yourself, "working faithfully so that I may share with those in need." Q&A 111 0f H.C. It also violates the sixth commandment as described by the H.C Lord's Day 40.
4. I think that the pulpit should never bully except through the power of the preached word. It may make me uncomfortable but then I need to ask is it my defiance of the Word or my obedience to God's word at bottom of this.
5. Amen to Christlikeness.
Larry
Posted in: Let's Talk About Pastor Compensation
I'm now 72 and a retired CRCNA pastor. Early in my career I would come up against the suggestion that I should consider going RCA since that had a better retirement plan for pastors. Of course I never considered doing that but It made me question if the defined pension plan we have is better than the RCA contribution plan. I really never pursued this then nor do I want to now. Our younger pastors however have much more of a stake in this than I. I hope they respond.
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
Very Good Matthew. While it may not be appropriate or wise to allow immigration and refugee conversation in the pulpit we need to also affirm that it is not illegal nor should other evangelical Christians have to carry the water while CRC clergy play it cool. Many evangelical pastors have spoken against the present ban on certain immigrants and refugees. Imagine how the story of Ruth in the bible would be changed if Israel had a ban on refugees and immigrants especially the Moabites.
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
What must a minister do when he believes scripture teaches caring for refugees. Period .
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
It sounds to me like Doug, John, and others would approve, like the church in Germany once did when they refused to speak up against Hitler, of such ethical issues as slavery, apartheid, racism, sexism. I do not buy it. Do you really mean the institutional church has no obligation to officially speak out against such evils?
Your easy distinction between individual Christians and the church as institute is tidy but it denies the church of being salt and light in the real world of evil. If fellow Christians cannot accept speaking out against such evils I suggest they should take it up with God.
Posted in: How Should the Church Respond to Trump’s Travel Ban?
Doug,
You have greatly relieved my mind. I thought you and the others did not want me or others to preach or teach that a ban on Syrian Refugees was unbiblical. Now I understand you as saying the institutional church may preach against all things that are contrary to scripture such as banning refugees, immigrants, racism, sexism, ruthless capitalism, irresponsible socialism, materialism etc. So we agree ministers in the CRCNA must preach the Word of God on all these matters and let the chips fall where they may.
Larry
Posted in: What Bible Verse Gives You Hope for 2017?
The verses that I am holding on to is : "Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority, and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy to be destroyed is death. For he has put everything under his feet. Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all." (1 Corinthians 15: 24-28)
In light of God's victory, political victories lose their appeal and importance.
I am privileged to be engaged in God's kingdom and victory by his grace.
Posted in: What Surprises You About the Current Status of Women in Ministry in the CRC?
What pleasantly surprises me is the number of 100 women who have been ordained in the CRC.
Larry Van Essen
Posted in: Election Stress Disorder and the Mind of Christ
Timely post and one that deals with my family and church member relations. We have made party loyalty more important than our unity in Christ. Statements like"I cannot see how a Christian could vote for Trump or Clinton" are too abundant and thoughtful and caring dialogue are too rare.