Lubbert, apology accepted. The reason to use the most recent membership numbers to work on your budget, is that your budget is based on what will be contributed in the year to come. If your membership drops drastically between the time you submit your roll numbers to the yearbook, and the time you make your budget, it does not make sense to assume that no membership changes have occurred.
I don't really want to continue this conversation... but I will point out the converse of what you have said, which was that 20% of members may not attend, can also be possible, so that 20 or 30% of contributing attenders may not be "registered members".
Some people make a distinction between an "official" worship service, and other gatherings. At official worship services elders should supervise and attend. If elders are not present, it will be an unusual circumstance. If elders are absent without good reasons, then the church is likely sick. But I agree that former elders or off-duty elders can be designated by consistory to fulfill that role of supervision and regulation, although it ought to be done preferably by the consistory/other elders and not by the pastor, who is after all being supervised ultimately.
Ultimately it is the decision of the consistory whether a service can be held without an elder present. It should be a conscious, not an accidental decision.
I think Ron has made a good point. Exit interviews can be useful, but sometimes those who depart will not be willing to actively participate for various reasons. They may be afraid that whatever constructive criticism they might give, could be taken in the wrong way, just because they are leaving, when the reasons for leaving are entirely different, ie. personal family, friends, business opportunities, lifestyle, etc. and have nothing really to do with the church itself. On the other hand, I think it is wise to provide the opportunity.
While God can use people of all ages to serve in his kingdom, and in his church, it would not be appropriate or beneficial to have teenagers or very new christians to lead and rule if older (elder) christians are available to do so. It is quite possible for many teenagers to do deaconal work without being ordained as ruling deacons, since every church member ought to engage to some extent in deaconal activites, such as caring for the less fortunate. But the idea that the youngers should be elders runs counter and contrary to the notion that learning and experience and wisdom in the Christian life are gained through time. It runs contrary to the whole idea of the title of 'elders" as well. Sometimes, if older people are younger christians, then they too would not be good candidates for eldership, even while they would still have lots of opportunity for service. On the other hand, I agree that qualifications for eldership should be based primarily on spiritual maturity, not on chronological age.
I would suggest that you do not worry too much about what others do. Rather, ask yourself what is edifying in your situation. We have decided to have Sunday School classes , including also adult Bible study, before church, not during church. Some sunday school classes sing, others do not. Sometimes they get together to sing, other times not. But every Sunday the sall children do come to the front at the beginning of the service to hear a story and to sing some songs (mostly by memory), in front of the congregation. And the rest of the congregation sings with them. It is a way for everyone to share in the joy of the children, and for the children to know that they are welcome in church.
If you are in the tornado zone, you may want to consider what you can do to help there. Perhaps gather a group of young people for a few days of cleaning up, or home building, or sorting of materials....
While official elders should be ordained, scripture seems to indicate that many people can be pastors, or pastoral in terms of relating to fellow christians. This means that others besides elders and deacons can visit the sick, assist the needy, teach, provide pastoral advice in stressful situations, etc. And while all elders should be apt to teach, it is not necessary for all teachers to be elders. So some teaching jobs can be done by non-elders.
It would also be possible if a serving elder is overwhelmed at times by people who need attention due to illness, stressful family situations, job loss, etc., that he could ask for assistance from non-serving or "retired" elders. If these "retired" or "off-duty" elders took their initial calling seriously, then they wouldn't mind helping out if they have the capacity, time and ability.
I've always assumed it was mandatory to bring the church budget to the annual congregational meeting for approval. All churches I have been in have done this. All non-profits societies and charities are required to have an annual meeting of membership with proper notice, which approves the financial statement and the next years budget, at least in Canada. This also improves communication, and increases understanding and "ownership". Sometimes adjustments to budget are made at the annual congregational meeting.
This budgeting is not done by the deacons, but by the council as a whole in cooperation with the treasurer, who may or may not be a member of council, but usually is not. Generally the deacons submit a list of proposed offerings to the council for approval, but this is not part of the budget as it is over and above the budget.
We do not use pledges, but rather assume the giving on the principles of giving as the Lord blesses, and as the need arises.
All of the above comments have been very good and very practical. I only wish to comment that the parish model does not impress me much. Particularly since there are many churches covering a particular geographic area. To be a member without participating and without committing is not what a church is about. A church can minister to non-members as well as members.
Usually, the chair of consistory/council would not be a first time elder, but one who has a bit more experience. This would make the task less daunting. As far as continuity is concerned, it is most important to keep the congregation in the loop about most issues. When there are more confidential issues at stake, then have a transition meeting where both the retiring and "new" elders participate. If necessary, continue to involve the retiring elders with sensitive ongoing issues until certain issues that need their help are dealt with.
Perhaps there a couple of aspects to being inactive. In some cases, there are members who attend somewhat regularly, but are relatively inactive in any type of participation. They come three times out of four sundays, come at the last minute, leave almost immediately when over, and do not participate in family church life. Encouragement and "trickery" :) is required to increase their activity.
Other inactives who sometimes do not attend church for a month or more with no real good reasons such as vacation or illness, require a different approach. Phone calls, visit, visits, and prayer is needed. Sometimes personal relationships need to be mended or begun.
But in the long run, a persistent inactive who does not attend is not really a member of the church; they have lapsed their attendance and participation. They need to be aware that membership is not having your name on a list, but it is being part of something, participating in the life. It is not really the church that lapses their membership; they lapse their own membership.
Some churches have more attenders than members, maybe because they sense the importance and committment of membership. But some of these attenders are more committed than some christians who are members (if you compare some churches, or some denominations to each other).
A list of inactives ought not to exist for accounting purposes, but for ministering purposes. (or did I misunderstand your use of the term "accounting".?) It is not to keep track of people on a list , but to keep track of what is being done with them as individuals. Did someone call them? Did someone visit them? What is bothering them? Are we praying for them? Are they short of finances? Do they feel discouraged? etc. This should become important right away, when they are missed once or twice, not wait until they have been gone for three months.
Posted in: When do we count members for Ministry Shares?
Lubbert, apology accepted. The reason to use the most recent membership numbers to work on your budget, is that your budget is based on what will be contributed in the year to come. If your membership drops drastically between the time you submit your roll numbers to the yearbook, and the time you make your budget, it does not make sense to assume that no membership changes have occurred.
Posted in: When do we count members for Ministry Shares?
I don't really want to continue this conversation... but I will point out the converse of what you have said, which was that 20% of members may not attend, can also be possible, so that 20 or 30% of contributing attenders may not be "registered members".
Posted in: Are elders needed for worship services?
Some people make a distinction between an "official" worship service, and other gatherings. At official worship services elders should supervise and attend. If elders are not present, it will be an unusual circumstance. If elders are absent without good reasons, then the church is likely sick. But I agree that former elders or off-duty elders can be designated by consistory to fulfill that role of supervision and regulation, although it ought to be done preferably by the consistory/other elders and not by the pastor, who is after all being supervised ultimately.
Ultimately it is the decision of the consistory whether a service can be held without an elder present. It should be a conscious, not an accidental decision.
Posted in: Does anyone have a list of questions for an exit interview for departing members?
I think Ron has made a good point. Exit interviews can be useful, but sometimes those who depart will not be willing to actively participate for various reasons. They may be afraid that whatever constructive criticism they might give, could be taken in the wrong way, just because they are leaving, when the reasons for leaving are entirely different, ie. personal family, friends, business opportunities, lifestyle, etc. and have nothing really to do with the church itself. On the other hand, I think it is wise to provide the opportunity.
Posted in: Youth Serving on Council?
While God can use people of all ages to serve in his kingdom, and in his church, it would not be appropriate or beneficial to have teenagers or very new christians to lead and rule if older (elder) christians are available to do so. It is quite possible for many teenagers to do deaconal work without being ordained as ruling deacons, since every church member ought to engage to some extent in deaconal activites, such as caring for the less fortunate. But the idea that the youngers should be elders runs counter and contrary to the notion that learning and experience and wisdom in the Christian life are gained through time. It runs contrary to the whole idea of the title of 'elders" as well. Sometimes, if older people are younger christians, then they too would not be good candidates for eldership, even while they would still have lots of opportunity for service. On the other hand, I agree that qualifications for eldership should be based primarily on spiritual maturity, not on chronological age.
Posted in: What Resources Do You Use When Singing With Kids?
I would suggest that you do not worry too much about what others do. Rather, ask yourself what is edifying in your situation. We have decided to have Sunday School classes , including also adult Bible study, before church, not during church. Some sunday school classes sing, others do not. Sometimes they get together to sing, other times not. But every Sunday the sall children do come to the front at the beginning of the service to hear a story and to sing some songs (mostly by memory), in front of the congregation. And the rest of the congregation sings with them. It is a way for everyone to share in the joy of the children, and for the children to know that they are welcome in church.
Posted in: What Should Be Included in a List of Best Practices for Deacons?
If you are in the tornado zone, you may want to consider what you can do to help there. Perhaps gather a group of young people for a few days of cleaning up, or home building, or sorting of materials....
Posted in: Job Sharing Elder Position?
While official elders should be ordained, scripture seems to indicate that many people can be pastors, or pastoral in terms of relating to fellow christians. This means that others besides elders and deacons can visit the sick, assist the needy, teach, provide pastoral advice in stressful situations, etc. And while all elders should be apt to teach, it is not necessary for all teachers to be elders. So some teaching jobs can be done by non-elders.
It would also be possible if a serving elder is overwhelmed at times by people who need attention due to illness, stressful family situations, job loss, etc., that he could ask for assistance from non-serving or "retired" elders. If these "retired" or "off-duty" elders took their initial calling seriously, then they wouldn't mind helping out if they have the capacity, time and ability.
Posted in: Is it right for the congregation to vote on the annual church budget?
I've always assumed it was mandatory to bring the church budget to the annual congregational meeting for approval. All churches I have been in have done this. All non-profits societies and charities are required to have an annual meeting of membership with proper notice, which approves the financial statement and the next years budget, at least in Canada. This also improves communication, and increases understanding and "ownership". Sometimes adjustments to budget are made at the annual congregational meeting.
This budgeting is not done by the deacons, but by the council as a whole in cooperation with the treasurer, who may or may not be a member of council, but usually is not. Generally the deacons submit a list of proposed offerings to the council for approval, but this is not part of the budget as it is over and above the budget.
We do not use pledges, but rather assume the giving on the principles of giving as the Lord blesses, and as the need arises.
Posted in: What Should We Do With Membership Records of Those Who Have Left the Church?
All of the above comments have been very good and very practical. I only wish to comment that the parish model does not impress me much. Particularly since there are many churches covering a particular geographic area. To be a member without participating and without committing is not what a church is about. A church can minister to non-members as well as members.
Posted in: Who has information on how to handle the training and support for the Council/Elder chairman?
Usually, the chair of consistory/council would not be a first time elder, but one who has a bit more experience. This would make the task less daunting. As far as continuity is concerned, it is most important to keep the congregation in the loop about most issues. When there are more confidential issues at stake, then have a transition meeting where both the retiring and "new" elders participate. If necessary, continue to involve the retiring elders with sensitive ongoing issues until certain issues that need their help are dealt with.
Posted in: What are people doing about declaring members "inactive" and ministering to them?
Perhaps there a couple of aspects to being inactive. In some cases, there are members who attend somewhat regularly, but are relatively inactive in any type of participation. They come three times out of four sundays, come at the last minute, leave almost immediately when over, and do not participate in family church life. Encouragement and "trickery" :) is required to increase their activity.
Other inactives who sometimes do not attend church for a month or more with no real good reasons such as vacation or illness, require a different approach. Phone calls, visit, visits, and prayer is needed. Sometimes personal relationships need to be mended or begun.
But in the long run, a persistent inactive who does not attend is not really a member of the church; they have lapsed their attendance and participation. They need to be aware that membership is not having your name on a list, but it is being part of something, participating in the life. It is not really the church that lapses their membership; they lapse their own membership.
Some churches have more attenders than members, maybe because they sense the importance and committment of membership. But some of these attenders are more committed than some christians who are members (if you compare some churches, or some denominations to each other).
A list of inactives ought not to exist for accounting purposes, but for ministering purposes. (or did I misunderstand your use of the term "accounting".?) It is not to keep track of people on a list , but to keep track of what is being done with them as individuals. Did someone call them? Did someone visit them? What is bothering them? Are we praying for them? Are they short of finances? Do they feel discouraged? etc. This should become important right away, when they are missed once or twice, not wait until they have been gone for three months.