Do we really need the example of Mars Hill's meteoric rise and calamitous fall to ask these questions? The CRCNA has been slowly, genteelly, and apparently irreversibly declining for30 years. Hasn't this been incentive to ask these questions? And if they are being asked, do results show that they are being snswered appropriately?
As usual, a very thoughtful and provocative post, Paul. Doesn't the CRCNA have reason to be anxious? It has been slowly cratering for twenty years. Now it has lost the generation between 18-39. This means, as I see it, that Imembers over 65 like me belong to the last generation of a viable CRC. When God calls us home, the church will pancake, it's population collapse by 50%, and it's revenue stream dry up. Do you believe that the current leadership which has overseen the decline will suddenly surprise us with the answer to our anxiety? If so, why?
Doug, You lost me. Is your argument that you've quoted Mt 25 often, that you've done tons for the poor, the elites in the CRCNA are under the influence of a liberal zeitgeist from which they can recover only by reading Christian Lander's latest tongu in cheek opus, therefore Synod needs to reject the Belhar. Seriously? Here's a suggestion on how to deal with the Belhar. When faced with a contentious problem that could rip the nascent church in two, the apostles in Acts 6 turned the problem over to the complainers to solve. Let Synod follow this example by giving the "Belhar matter" over to a committee composed of Black and Reformed, Hispanics (Lugo and people of his choice), Navajos (under the lead of Stanley Jim) and Koreans. Tell them to consult the Holy Spirit, pray often, make a decision, and the church will embrace it. Harry
You guys are a hoot! You've feigned surprise, warned me of the dangers of liberation theology, and suggested darkly that my hermeneutic may not be reformed. Does this stuff really work on people? In Acts 9 Jesus asks, Paul, Paul, why are you persecuting me?" thus identifying himself with the church. In Matthew 25 Jesus says, "Inasmuch as you've done it to the least of these, you've done it to me," thus identifying himself with a class of people I referred to as the poor. In addition in Mt 25 the Lord says that one's eternal weal or woe depends on how one has treated those with whom he identifies. I take him to mean that a saving faith in him will inevitably show itself in seeing others and serving them as he did himself. Absence of service indicates absence of saving faith. What you guys need to do is show how Jesus' identification in the Acts passage is different from his identification in the Matthew passage. Otherwise, your case falls to the ground. You need to need to make a compelling case, and I sorry, John, your interpretation of Mt 25 is neither cogent nor convincing. Without it it seems that you're opposing the Belhar on this issue because of prejudice and not principle. One other matter: if it is the case that the Belhar was written within the context of the Three Forms of Unity and the main point of the Belhar is to oppose the acculturation of the gospel to the sociology and practice of apartheid, it seems obvious why the Belhar does not summarize the gospel. The people to whom the Belhar was addresses knew the gospel and confessed it in the Forms of Unity. They just didn't live their confession. The Belhar calls upon the to not only acknowledge the gospel but live it as well. At a time in SouthAfrican history when some black leaders were singing "Bring Me My Machine Gun," the Belhar folks did the Christ-like thing: They appealed to their white brothers and sisters to stop their persecution, stop compromising the gospel, let the gospel speak to them again in all of its power, and begin living by the teachings of Jesus. This took real courage for the Belhar was written when the whites were still in power and apartheid was the order of the day. I loved to see the CRCNA adopt the Belhar as a fourth confession because when my kids and grand kids ask about it, I want to be able to tell the this contemporary Hebrews 11 story of faith. Harry Weidenaar
It's interesting to me that in all of this speculation about what Synod may do, no one has mentioned prayer and reliance on the Holy Spirit. This is particularly strange since Synod is a deliberative assembly, called to meet to open itself to the voice and leading of God. Everyone seems to know what to do with the Belhar but no one seems to want to ask God what he wants us to do with it. Let's check our opinions at the door, create space for God, and ask him for direction.
Spectacular about Cooper's analysis of the Belhar is his missing the point. The genius of the Belhar is its call to fellow Reformed Christians, all of whom confess the Three Forms of Unity, not to compromise the gospel. In the opinion of the authors and signers of the Belhar the Dutch Reformed Church was accommodating the gospel to the prevailing culture of apartheid rather than reforming the culture by the good news of the kingdom. The result was that the gospel was being robbed of its power, injustice continued unchallenged, and fellow Christians remained intractable and unrepentant. In his Banner article Cooper is silent about this.
Someone alleged in this conversation that the Belhar taught contrary to the Bible when it said that God is in a special way the God of the poor. Really? In his teaching in Mattew 25 Jesus speaks about feeding the hungry, giving drink to the thirsty, clothing thos who need it, visiting the sick, comforting those in prison, Thes people qualified as the poor in Jesus' day. They qualify as poor in our own (most people in prison in th USA are black and poor). Then he says if you did these things to them, you did it to him, and if you didn't do these things to them, you go to hell even if you say "Lord! Lord!" or can recite the Three Forms of Unity by rote. It seems then that Jesus has a massive preference for the poor.
The suggestion that we have dealt with racism in this country, that it is a thing of the past, and we should move on is preposterous. Has the person who made this statement talked with African Americans, Navajos, Hispanics, Koreans, and other minorities in the CRCNA to find out how the feel? Has the Banner published a lot of minority voices on the Belhar? Hmm!
For Synod to receive the Belhar as a testimony would be, in my opinion, the worst thing it could do. It would be a public relations nightmare. A testimony doesn't have the status of a confession, so we're we to accept the Belhar as a testimony, we would ion effect be saying to people of color that they have a place in the CRCNA: their place is in the balcony.
I'm really glad you're leading your youth group in a discussion of the Belhar. Here are two topics related to the Belhar you may want to talk about with your people:
1. At the time the Belhar was written the Dutch Reformed Church of South Africa, the creeds of which are identical to ours in the CRCNA, supported the evil ideology and practice of apartheid. In the opinion of the writers of the Belhar the DRC and other Christians in South Africa were compromising the gospel -- subordinating the teachings of the gospel to the culture of the day rather than submitting the culture of the day to the teachings of the gospel. The Belhar calls on Christians in South Africa and everywhere to put the gospel first. You may ask your people in what ways the gospel is being compromised by Christians today to the materialism, relativism, and individualism of contemporary culture and what they think they can do about it.
2. Many of the writers and signers of the Belhar Confession were/are black. That is, they were victims of the vicious apartheid system that separated black and white in South Africa. These people didn't reach for a gun to revolt against their oppressors, Instead, they reached for their Bibles, and with incredible courage and love called upon the white Christains who were victimizing them to live by the Scripture and creeds they confessed. In effect, they said to their white brothers and sisters: you taught us the gospel, we know it is true, now the most loving thing we can do for you is to ask you to live by it, repent, reaffirm the unity of believers whether they be black or white, do justice, and be reconciled to us. Ask your young people where they see this kind of profound love and courage in the church today, and if they don't see it, if Reformed Christians are more interested in dotting i's and crossing t's of doctrine rather than truly living the gospel, what has gone wrong and how can they make it right?
Posted in: The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill
Do we really need the example of Mars Hill's meteoric rise and calamitous fall to ask these questions? The CRCNA has been slowly, genteelly, and apparently irreversibly declining for30 years. Hasn't this been incentive to ask these questions? And if they are being asked, do results show that they are being snswered appropriately?
Posted in: Share Your 3-Word Prayer for the Human Sexuality Conversation
Let love lead!
Posted in: Using Only 3 Words, How Do You Currently Feel About Church?
Stuck in yesterday
Posted in: Compensation for Pulpit Supply?
In the Phoenix area, where I live, the rate is between 150 and 300.
Posted in: Angst
As usual, a very thoughtful and provocative post, Paul. Doesn't the CRCNA have reason to be anxious? It has been slowly cratering for twenty years. Now it has lost the generation between 18-39. This means, as I see it, that Imembers over 65 like me belong to the last generation of a viable CRC. When God calls us home, the church will pancake, it's population collapse by 50%, and it's revenue stream dry up. Do you believe that the current leadership which has overseen the decline will suddenly surprise us with the answer to our anxiety? If so, why?
Posted in: Belhar—Up, Down or Sideways?
Doug, You lost me. Is your argument that you've quoted Mt 25 often, that you've done tons for the poor, the elites in the CRCNA are under the influence of a liberal zeitgeist from which they can recover only by reading Christian Lander's latest tongu in cheek opus, therefore Synod needs to reject the Belhar. Seriously? Here's a suggestion on how to deal with the Belhar. When faced with a contentious problem that could rip the nascent church in two, the apostles in Acts 6 turned the problem over to the complainers to solve. Let Synod follow this example by giving the "Belhar matter" over to a committee composed of Black and Reformed, Hispanics (Lugo and people of his choice), Navajos (under the lead of Stanley Jim) and Koreans. Tell them to consult the Holy Spirit, pray often, make a decision, and the church will embrace it. Harry
Posted in: Belhar—Up, Down or Sideways?
You guys are a hoot! You've feigned surprise, warned me of the dangers of liberation theology, and suggested darkly that my hermeneutic may not be reformed. Does this stuff really work on people? In Acts 9 Jesus asks, Paul, Paul, why are you persecuting me?" thus identifying himself with the church. In Matthew 25 Jesus says, "Inasmuch as you've done it to the least of these, you've done it to me," thus identifying himself with a class of people I referred to as the poor. In addition in Mt 25 the Lord says that one's eternal weal or woe depends on how one has treated those with whom he identifies. I take him to mean that a saving faith in him will inevitably show itself in seeing others and serving them as he did himself. Absence of service indicates absence of saving faith. What you guys need to do is show how Jesus' identification in the Acts passage is different from his identification in the Matthew passage. Otherwise, your case falls to the ground. You need to need to make a compelling case, and I sorry, John, your interpretation of Mt 25 is neither cogent nor convincing. Without it it seems that you're opposing the Belhar on this issue because of prejudice and not principle. One other matter: if it is the case that the Belhar was written within the context of the Three Forms of Unity and the main point of the Belhar is to oppose the acculturation of the gospel to the sociology and practice of apartheid, it seems obvious why the Belhar does not summarize the gospel. The people to whom the Belhar was addresses knew the gospel and confessed it in the Forms of Unity. They just didn't live their confession. The Belhar calls upon the to not only acknowledge the gospel but live it as well. At a time in SouthAfrican history when some black leaders were singing "Bring Me My Machine Gun," the Belhar folks did the Christ-like thing: They appealed to their white brothers and sisters to stop their persecution, stop compromising the gospel, let the gospel speak to them again in all of its power, and begin living by the teachings of Jesus. This took real courage for the Belhar was written when the whites were still in power and apartheid was the order of the day. I loved to see the CRCNA adopt the Belhar as a fourth confession because when my kids and grand kids ask about it, I want to be able to tell the this contemporary Hebrews 11 story of faith. Harry Weidenaar
Posted in: Belhar—Up, Down or Sideways?
Just as I thought: you really have no argument. Harry Weidenaar
Posted in: Belhar—Up, Down or Sideways?
It's interesting to me that in all of this speculation about what Synod may do, no one has mentioned prayer and reliance on the Holy Spirit. This is particularly strange since Synod is a deliberative assembly, called to meet to open itself to the voice and leading of God. Everyone seems to know what to do with the Belhar but no one seems to want to ask God what he wants us to do with it. Let's check our opinions at the door, create space for God, and ask him for direction.
Harry Weidenaar
Posted in: Belhar—Up, Down or Sideways?
Spectacular about Cooper's analysis of the Belhar is his missing the point. The genius of the Belhar is its call to fellow Reformed Christians, all of whom confess the Three Forms of Unity, not to compromise the gospel. In the opinion of the authors and signers of the Belhar the Dutch Reformed Church was accommodating the gospel to the prevailing culture of apartheid rather than reforming the culture by the good news of the kingdom. The result was that the gospel was being robbed of its power, injustice continued unchallenged, and fellow Christians remained intractable and unrepentant. In his Banner article Cooper is silent about this.
Someone alleged in this conversation that the Belhar taught contrary to the Bible when it said that God is in a special way the God of the poor. Really? In his teaching in Mattew 25 Jesus speaks about feeding the hungry, giving drink to the thirsty, clothing thos who need it, visiting the sick, comforting those in prison, Thes people qualified as the poor in Jesus' day. They qualify as poor in our own (most people in prison in th USA are black and poor). Then he says if you did these things to them, you did it to him, and if you didn't do these things to them, you go to hell even if you say "Lord! Lord!" or can recite the Three Forms of Unity by rote. It seems then that Jesus has a massive preference for the poor.
The suggestion that we have dealt with racism in this country, that it is a thing of the past, and we should move on is preposterous. Has the person who made this statement talked with African Americans, Navajos, Hispanics, Koreans, and other minorities in the CRCNA to find out how the feel? Has the Banner published a lot of minority voices on the Belhar? Hmm!
For Synod to receive the Belhar as a testimony would be, in my opinion, the worst thing it could do. It would be a public relations nightmare. A testimony doesn't have the status of a confession, so we're we to accept the Belhar as a testimony, we would ion effect be saying to people of color that they have a place in the CRCNA: their place is in the balcony.
Harry weidenaar
Posted in: The Belhar Confession and Youth Ministry
Paul,
I'm really glad you're leading your youth group in a discussion of the Belhar. Here are two topics related to the Belhar you may want to talk about with your people:
1. At the time the Belhar was written the Dutch Reformed Church of South Africa, the creeds of which are identical to ours in the CRCNA, supported the evil ideology and practice of apartheid. In the opinion of the writers of the Belhar the DRC and other Christians in South Africa were compromising the gospel -- subordinating the teachings of the gospel to the culture of the day rather than submitting the culture of the day to the teachings of the gospel. The Belhar calls on Christians in South Africa and everywhere to put the gospel first. You may ask your people in what ways the gospel is being compromised by Christians today to the materialism, relativism, and individualism of contemporary culture and what they think they can do about it.
2. Many of the writers and signers of the Belhar Confession were/are black. That is, they were victims of the vicious apartheid system that separated black and white in South Africa. These people didn't reach for a gun to revolt against their oppressors, Instead, they reached for their Bibles, and with incredible courage and love called upon the white Christains who were victimizing them to live by the Scripture and creeds they confessed. In effect, they said to their white brothers and sisters: you taught us the gospel, we know it is true, now the most loving thing we can do for you is to ask you to live by it, repent, reaffirm the unity of believers whether they be black or white, do justice, and be reconciled to us. Ask your young people where they see this kind of profound love and courage in the church today, and if they don't see it, if Reformed Christians are more interested in dotting i's and crossing t's of doctrine rather than truly living the gospel, what has gone wrong and how can they make it right?
Harry Weidenaar