I appreciate you writing about Ruth Tuckers book. In my congregation women are not permitted to be in 'office'. I have had 2 conversations about this with elders recently. One elder had been in council in another church where women were equal members and he much prefers that. The second elder is adamant about women not being in office but he still has a high respect for me and encouraged me to speak out to council on issues that I know about. He says that he pushes other elders and deacons to value the women in our church community. This man has asked me for help in the past... I told him that I know which men value me and which ones do not. The second group there is no point in talking to.
What bothers me about this article is that it has been here for 10 days and I am the first one to comment. There is a very small group that comment on any issue under 'safe church' So not matter how good the writing most of the CRC never reads it. As I have said before, I am banging my head on a brick wall -and it hurts.
Thanks for posting this Wouldn't I like to see every person in our churches see this movie or at least read your article. As long as they do realize abuse is in every church not just this one in the movie.
When people are new to Christianity they are probably not going to know any songs. Why would they think they should? it might even be good for them to know that they are not the only ones who don't know a song. That everyone has to learn them at some point. I agree about not putting a new song right after the message.
In our church the worship team will introduce a new song by singing it just before the service begins. Then it will be sung again during the service. We do not teach it line by line, but it is stated that it is a new song and that most of us might not know it. We will be invited to join in the chorus after the second time or maybe in the last verse.
If we are told it is a new song we know that and we just join in when we can, I have not heard that this is a problem for people. Sometimes a new song will be sung as a solo or just the worship team during the offering. Then another day it will be sung before and during the service.
I do not have to sing to get good from a song. In fact when i am deeply impacted by the words I often stop singing and listen.
I like this article because it brings hope. Also it reminds me that everyone's walk with God is different. When a person begins to believe in Jesus they are not usually all healed up and just lovely all at once. We need to feed them and love on them and be patient and they will grow into who God sees them as.
I appreciate how thoughtful you were about this prayer and if you would talk about forgiveness or not. I too have been hurt by forgiveness being pushed on me. People think that forgiving a person means that what that person did does not matter, or you cannot hold them to account. One thought I had was that if I forgive then it negates what was done to me, as if it wasn't that bad or it did not really hurt me. Talking about forgiveness needs to include what forgiveness does and does not mean. Having said that, I have come through a long journey to understand that forgiveness is a Gift. I am thankful and appreciate it that I have been forgiven by God (and others) and i am thankful and appreciate that I have been freed to heal more when He enables me to forgive those who hurt me.
Some people never repent or change and are unsafe. With serious offense, true reconciliation can only happen when the offender is repentant, asks forgiveness, walks with accountability, proves themselves, takes responsibility, makes restitution...... However, I have been able to have a good kind of a relationship with some people who seriously hurt me, where I chose to walk in grace and forgiveness and they did not know how hard that was for me. I was able to choose to love them and help care for them. God brought this about in me where i did not think that was possible.
For sure I too an careful about who I 'let in' to my deep pain. I do consider it an honor and a gift when others share their pain with me. Not that it is easy but it is important to do.
For me I continually need to be reminded about Grace so I appreciate this song. It never occurred to me to think that this was making light of sin. But I can understand why you could think that.
Regarding teaching your children about sin. Your example is important. Letting them hear your own confession, repentance, acceptance of forgiveness (age appropriate of course) Asking their forgiveness when you have wronged them and teaching them to say I forgive you and praying with them about the issue, asking God to heal them of what you did to them and again letting them hear that you are thankful for His forgiveness. When your kids need a timeout or other consequence praying with them about that. Asking them to tell you and God that they are sorry. Reassuring them they are forgiven by you and God. Praying for them to learn not to do whatever the thing was. Asking forgiveness of siblings, friends and giving forgiveness.
I agree whole heartedly with this statement: "There is a deep need for more open conversation creating an environment of trust and safety, policies that put children’s safety first, and worship services that lament abuse, pray for justice, and open the door for healing for its victims." I am very concerned about the safety of children and fragile people and I long for our church to become a safe place where children know where to go for help. It makes me sad that secrets cannot be told and survivors suffer silently for many years, if not their whole life, without help.
Being part of a discipling group and then beginning my own group I agree that there is no way to go fast. We tried that in the first one and it did not work. Learning new practices is one thing, Actually using the new practices is another thing entirely. One needs time and the encouragement of others on the same road.
The fruit in my life is becoming more intentional in my walk with Jesus. Being able, with His help of course, to actually do the things He calls me to do. Another fruit/joy is seeing the changes in the lives of those we are discipling.
I appreciate this article and also agree with Bonnie's comments I am not sure how to encourage congregations to talk about these topics (much less become involved and supportive). Outside of church culture it seems much easier to discuss abuse issues, rape, domestic violence etc. Within church culture many are embarrassed to use words that could refer to anything about any type sexual activity. There is the fallacy that nothing 'like that' could ever happen in our congregation. Add to this the tendency to blame the victim in so many ways and the easy lie that survivors just need to forgive the abusers and everything will be okay! I would like to see our churches get to a place where they can say first. "I am so sorry this was done to you" "What can we do to help?"
Posted in: Black and White Bible, Black and Blue Wife
I appreciate you writing about Ruth Tuckers book.
In my congregation women are not permitted to be in 'office'.
I have had 2 conversations about this with elders recently. One elder had been in council in another church where women were equal members and he much prefers that.
The second elder is adamant about women not being in office but he still has a high respect for me and encouraged me to speak out to council on issues that I know about. He says that he pushes other elders and deacons to value the women in our church community. This man has asked me for help in the past...
I told him that I know which men value me and which ones do not. The second group there is no point in talking to.
What bothers me about this article is that it has been here for 10 days and I am the first one to comment.
There is a very small group that comment on any issue under 'safe church'
So not matter how good the writing most of the CRC never reads it.
As I have said before, I am banging my head on a brick wall -and it hurts.
Posted in: The Safest Place in the World
Yes, a beautiful testimony.
I long for this for all of us.
Posted in: Why Every Church Leader Should Watch Spotlight
Thanks for posting this
Wouldn't I like to see every person in our churches see this movie or at least read your article.
As long as they do realize abuse is in every church not just this one in the movie.
Posted in: 4 Reasons Not to Teach a New Song During the Service
When people are new to Christianity they are probably not going to know any songs. Why would they think they should? it might even be good for them to know that they are not the only ones who don't know a song. That everyone has to learn them at some point.
I agree about not putting a new song right after the message.
In our church the worship team will introduce a new song by singing it just before the service begins.
Then it will be sung again during the service.
We do not teach it line by line, but it is stated that it is a new song and that most of us might not know it. We will be invited to join in the chorus after the second time or maybe in the last verse.
If we are told it is a new song we know that and we just join in when we can,
I have not heard that this is a problem for people.
Sometimes a new song will be sung as a solo or just the worship team during the offering.
Then another day it will be sung before and during the service.
I do not have to sing to get good from a song.
In fact when i am deeply impacted by the words I often stop singing and listen.
Posted in: God Said, “Live!”
I like this article because it brings hope.
Also it reminds me that everyone's walk with God is different.
When a person begins to believe in Jesus they are not usually all healed up and just lovely all at once.
We need to feed them and love on them and be patient and they will grow into who God sees them as.
Posted in: Forgiveness
I appreciate how thoughtful you were about this prayer and if you would talk about forgiveness or not.
I too have been hurt by forgiveness being pushed on me.
People think that forgiving a person means that what that person did does not matter, or you cannot hold them to account.
One thought I had was that if I forgive then it negates what was done to me, as if it wasn't that bad or it did not really hurt me.
Talking about forgiveness needs to include what forgiveness does and does not mean.
Having said that, I have come through a long journey to understand that forgiveness is a Gift.
I am thankful and appreciate it that I have been forgiven by God (and others) and i am thankful and appreciate that I have been freed to heal more when He enables me to forgive those who hurt me.
Posted in: Forgiveness
I agree with you both.
Some people never repent or change and are unsafe.
With serious offense, true reconciliation can only happen when the offender is repentant, asks forgiveness, walks with accountability, proves themselves, takes responsibility, makes restitution......
However, I have been able to have a good kind of a relationship with some people who seriously hurt me, where I chose to walk in grace and forgiveness and they did not know how hard that was for me. I was able to choose to love them and help care for them. God brought this about in me where i did not think that was possible.
Posted in: Forgiveness
For sure I too an careful about who I 'let in' to my deep pain.
I do consider it an honor and a gift when others share their pain with me. Not that it is easy but it is important to do.
Posted in: Does Sin Not Matter Anymore?
For me I continually need to be reminded about Grace so I appreciate this song.
It never occurred to me to think that this was making light of sin.
But I can understand why you could think that.
Regarding teaching your children about sin.
Your example is important.
Letting them hear your own confession, repentance, acceptance of forgiveness (age appropriate of course)
Asking their forgiveness when you have wronged them and teaching them to say I forgive you and praying with them about the issue, asking God to heal them of what you did to them and again letting them hear that you are thankful for His forgiveness.
When your kids need a timeout or other consequence praying with them about that. Asking them to tell you and God that they are sorry. Reassuring them they are forgiven by you and God. Praying for them to learn not to do whatever the thing was. Asking forgiveness of siblings, friends and giving forgiveness.
Posted in: Abuse Awareness Sunday
I agree whole heartedly with this statement:
"There is a deep need for more open conversation creating an environment of trust and safety, policies that put children’s safety first, and worship services that lament abuse, pray for justice, and open the door for healing for its victims."
I am very concerned about the safety of children and fragile people and I long for our church to become a safe place where children know where to go for help.
It makes me sad that secrets cannot be told and survivors suffer silently for many years, if not their whole life, without help.
Posted in: The Speed of Discipleship
Being part of a discipling group and then beginning my own group I agree that there is no way to go fast.
We tried that in the first one and it did not work.
Learning new practices is one thing,
Actually using the new practices is another thing entirely.
One needs time and the encouragement of others on the same road.
The fruit in my life is becoming more intentional in my walk with Jesus. Being able, with His help of course, to actually do the things He calls me to do.
Another fruit/joy is seeing the changes in the lives of those we are discipling.
Posted in: Crying Rape
I appreciate this article and also agree with Bonnie's comments
I am not sure how to encourage congregations to talk about these topics (much less become involved and supportive).
Outside of church culture it seems much easier to discuss abuse issues, rape, domestic violence etc.
Within church culture many are embarrassed to use words that could refer to anything about any type sexual activity. There is the fallacy that nothing 'like that' could ever happen in our congregation. Add to this the tendency to blame the victim in so many ways and the easy lie that survivors just need to forgive the abusers and everything will be okay!
I would like to see our churches get to a place where they can say first.
"I am so sorry this was done to you"
"What can we do to help?"