You are right that God is sovereign and he advances his kingdom. A recent book, A Wind in the House of Islam makes the point that God is bringing Muslims to Christ whether in historic or insider paradigms. I think it is also important to recognize that Calvin’s views of Muslims (whom he referred to as Turks) were in the context of the Ottoman threat to Europe. Calvin had no opportunities to live and interact with Muslims as we do today.
It is maybe good to note that hyper-Muslim friendly translations have been pretty well repudiated by the recent report of the World Evangelical Alliance. I think this issue is behind us – I hope so. Where Muslims choose to remain inside Islam I think it is often the choice of the Muslim himself or herself in his or her context to decide what is best. Often over time it becomes more possible and desirable to leave Islam (however I recognize there are more extreme views on this). Certainly there will always be “the offense of the Gospel” but where possible I don’t see a problem with reducing barriers, especially if they are cultural and not theological.
I understand your concerns in this area but worry you adding to the severe polarization of ideas that we live with in ministry among Muslims by raising these issues in this way.
I have good memories of my oral comp - it was challenging but also supportive. I would respond that the government has a responsibility to use violence according to Romans 13 to protect civil society and in the case of ISIS religious minorities and other populations. But I think the sermon of the mount applies more individually as we relate to Muslims in our daily lives. We need to respond in love rather than in fear and suspicion. This may involve turning the other cheek and for sure walking the extra mile. I think that the church can respond in this way as well to increasing numbers of Muslims in our communities. So I can support the states right to use violence and at the same time respond in love to my neighbor. Having said that, I am concerned with the increasing loss of individual freedom in western societies in the name of protecting us from terrorism and the many incursions in the middle east in the name of foreign policy (not just by the USA and Canada but by other western nations since colonial days). We can support just war theory if we acknowledge our poor track record in restraining ourselves from violent intervention - which only seems to lead to more extremism and instability in the middle east. Libya is a good example where western nations intervened to remove a dictator but had no long term plan to provide a functioning democratic and civil society.
I think Bill we have been living under the auspices of Constantine for 1700 years but that is less and less the case in a post-Christian society. Any advantages that we derived from Christendom are long gone and now we are entering a period where life will be more like the situation Christians faced in the pre-Constantinian environment in the Roman Empire. This will mean a change in thinking about how we approach the world. We will need a lot more humility.
I agree one hundred percent that the mission field is all around us and that we are to invite people into the kingdom - and live in a winsome way that draws them in. That is what Salaam Project is all about. But CR World Missions has survived for 125 years because people were also willing to give of their hard earned income and many have heard the Gospel because of it. So I would say yes, reach out to your neighbor locally, but if you feel called to support your missionaries through prayer and finances - go for it. Thanks for blogging.
Thank you Salaam for your comments and I especially liked your comment about the power of love overcoming the love of power. The problem that ISIS is presenting to the world is a serious one, and I noticed in the news that even the Pope has changed track and allowed for limited military engagement to protect religious minorities in Iraq. He did say that they should be stopped although he did not want to use the word bombed. He also (rightly I think) urged more of a UN response rather than a unilateral US response. The protection of religious minorities is a clear need in this case (Christian and other). But I hesitate to promote the use of force further than necessary - especially as other factors play into the stability of Iraq - sunni - shia conflict for example. It is not always easy to separate the spiritual from the political in the Middle East. To quote Dr. Shenk, Muhammad rode into Mecca with an army of 10,000 soldiers. Jesus road into Jerusalem on a donkey surrounded by children. It seems that our default position should be to seek peace, encourage Muslims to speak out against violence as a doctrine of jihad, find peace building opportunities for dialogue (perhaps around the minority view that violent passages of the Quran are limited to the time of Muhammad). In general help Muslims find peace. I think the Saudi ruling class is just as alarmed by ISIS as a threat to their state as is the West, so perhaps this opens up new opportunities to rethink Wahabi teaching.
While I don't disagree that humans seem to swing on the pendulum, I think moving away from Christian Zionism to Christian Palestinianism is positive - if only as a corrective to a theological error. The fact is that Israel has forfeited the covenant as a nation - the hope of individual Jews is found in Jesus Christ. The hope of individual Palestinians is found in Jesus Christ. Therefore we no longer have a theological reason to prop up Israel. Yes Israel has every right to exist as a nation and to protect itself. But as Christians we are also concerned about the plight of the oppressed, the poor, the prisoner, and the Palestinians are prisoners in Gaza. So I don't think it is anti-semitic to hold Israel accountable for their actions in Gaza. I support some pendulum swinging - but as with all things - not too far.
Thank you for the comments. The chapter in Tennant's book is very good. The point about Luke 8 is well raised. God uses all kinds of approaches and in this case a very open approach worked well in this context. Within Israel Jesus often asked people to keep quiet until the time came for him to be fully revealed. I think giving believers the freedom to follow the Spirit's leading as to how open they are about their new faith is what is important. One book I recommend in this regard is "A Wind in the House of Islam," by David Garrison.
Thank you Salaam for your reply. I appreciate your responses and admit that we do need to hear both sides of this debate.The way in which Christians respond to Muslims will only become more and more imperative as globalization continues to bring us together. My goal is to break down some of the barriers that have been built up in the media and other places that separate our two faiths. We have been led to believe there has to be a clash of civilizations and that religion leads to conflict (aka Richard Dawkins). On the other hand, I am not so naive that I do not see challenges to other faiths in the Islamic worldview (particularly their desire to create an Islamic state). However we have to be careful that our efforts to label the other in certain ways does not blind us to our own militaristic efforts to spread western ideas (conflated with Christianity).
I do have Abdu Murray's book on my reading list so hopefully I will get to that in the next few months. In my efforts to build bridges with people of other faiths I continue to believe that Jesus is the only way, truth and life and that there is only one mediator between God and humankind. I just want to steer clear of religious arrogance that is based more in religious systems rather than actual faith in Jesus. Thank you for mentioning that fear mongering is not our best approach. I continue to be concerned about the level of anti-Muslim sentiment in our churches and hope that we can find a realistic and peace oriented approach to our Muslim neighbors.
Thank you for your comments Mike. I agree that the world is fallen and that culture and religion are affected by the fall. So I don't discount this and I don't want to give the impression that I think that followers of other faiths can avoid the punishment that comes from sin. I would rather seize the "grains of truth" and point people to the Gospel. So my desire to respect Muslims, learn from them, and dialogue with them comes with a firm belief that salvation is found in Jesus Christ and only through Jesus, the one Mediator between God and human kind. So in my desire to find "truth" in other faith systems, I ultimately want to help people find Jesus. This can lead to some tensions as we dialogue with other faiths (how can we dialogue when we are trying to convert?). I think that we have to allow the Holy Spirit to lead and as we follow the Missio Dei and then reach out honestly and with humility to people of other faiths.
Thank you Salaam for your comments. As I replied also to Mike, I do not wish to discount our "unregenerate hearts." Romans 1 would back you up for sure. Your last paragraph is true, in Islam Muhammad has eclipsed Jesus and the Umma has replaced the Church. Muslims do not think of "salvation' in the same way that Christians, because they lack a true picture of the fall and the depths of our depravity. These are all points well taken and I hope that we do not minimize these serious differences in our approach.
I think my attempts to build a bridge relate more to seeing the Quran and the Bible as sacred texts for two different populations, the former being influenced by the latter (my view, it would not be held by Islamic theologians). So in respecting their text and their beliefs I seek to find points of connection. This in no way legitimizes the Quran theologically or attempts to put them on the same level. I simply want to learn from my Muslim friend how he understands the Quran and compare it to the Bible, hopefully shedding light on God's path of salvation through out history. I would hope that my Muslim friend would be interested in reading the Bible as instructed in the Quran. In the process I am aware of the dangers of comparing terms and beliefs and infusing them with my understandings. Hopefully dialogue will help with truly understanding the other - a mixture of appreciating the other's beliefs but also challenging them where they are different.
Ignoring the "slough of despond" would indeed be wrong but I do not think it is the best place to start with our Muslim friends (it may have more traction with agnostics/atheists).
Thanks for the comments - it is good to see this Muslim ministry forum in use. I hope it will foster more good discussions. I appreciate the cautions and understand clearly the anti-Christian polemical nature of the Quran. Salvation is not found there. However I do find that my own understanding of Christian theology has been enhanced through reading the Quran. So to respond to Salaam, I am not thinking of it as a entre but rather appreciating the beauty of our theology (specifically the Trinity). This could be used in an apologetic way as well. To illustrate in another way, if the eternal word of Allah is the Quran, and the Quran exists eternally, than is Allah truly one - or is he two? In Christianity the eternal word of God - Jesus - exists eternally and because we have a trinitarian understanding of God, we can accept this fact. So I have a better appreciation of my own faith in the end.
Thanks for your question Kim. I had not thought about the implications of the Shahada. The question of Muhammad is a good one. He did not point people to the God of the Christians, although he was more sympathetic in his Meccan suras. In fact, I believe he saw himself as a prophet to the Jews and Christians as well as the Muslims at that stage. It was only later in Medina that this seems to have changed. What we can say is that Muhammad was a reformer who sought to convert his people from polytheism to monotheism. All monotheists, including Christians, should appreciate this. So I maintain that we worship the same God, however, we fundamentally understand him in different ways. Certainly Muhammad did. In terms of how we relate to Muslims, I would speak of Muhammad as a God seeker and a reformer in his culture. We don't encourage conversation by speaking ill of him. But pointing people to Jesus, the ultimate reformer is our goal.
Posted in: Does Salvation Belong to the LORD?
Dear Salaam,
You are right that God is sovereign and he advances his kingdom. A recent book, A Wind in the House of Islam makes the point that God is bringing Muslims to Christ whether in historic or insider paradigms. I think it is also important to recognize that Calvin’s views of Muslims (whom he referred to as Turks) were in the context of the Ottoman threat to Europe. Calvin had no opportunities to live and interact with Muslims as we do today.
It is maybe good to note that hyper-Muslim friendly translations have been pretty well repudiated by the recent report of the World Evangelical Alliance. I think this issue is behind us – I hope so. Where Muslims choose to remain inside Islam I think it is often the choice of the Muslim himself or herself in his or her context to decide what is best. Often over time it becomes more possible and desirable to leave Islam (however I recognize there are more extreme views on this). Certainly there will always be “the offense of the Gospel” but where possible I don’t see a problem with reducing barriers, especially if they are cultural and not theological.
I understand your concerns in this area but worry you adding to the severe polarization of ideas that we live with in ministry among Muslims by raising these issues in this way.
Blessings.
Posted in: The Pastor’s Quandary
I have good memories of my oral comp - it was challenging but also supportive. I would respond that the government has a responsibility to use violence according to Romans 13 to protect civil society and in the case of ISIS religious minorities and other populations. But I think the sermon of the mount applies more individually as we relate to Muslims in our daily lives. We need to respond in love rather than in fear and suspicion. This may involve turning the other cheek and for sure walking the extra mile. I think that the church can respond in this way as well to increasing numbers of Muslims in our communities. So I can support the states right to use violence and at the same time respond in love to my neighbor. Having said that, I am concerned with the increasing loss of individual freedom in western societies in the name of protecting us from terrorism and the many incursions in the middle east in the name of foreign policy (not just by the USA and Canada but by other western nations since colonial days). We can support just war theory if we acknowledge our poor track record in restraining ourselves from violent intervention - which only seems to lead to more extremism and instability in the middle east. Libya is a good example where western nations intervened to remove a dictator but had no long term plan to provide a functioning democratic and civil society.
Posted in: Living Well Amongst Religious Diversity
I think Bill we have been living under the auspices of Constantine for 1700 years but that is less and less the case in a post-Christian society. Any advantages that we derived from Christendom are long gone and now we are entering a period where life will be more like the situation Christians faced in the pre-Constantinian environment in the Roman Empire. This will mean a change in thinking about how we approach the world. We will need a lot more humility.
Posted in: The Front Door Field
Hi Joshua,
I agree one hundred percent that the mission field is all around us and that we are to invite people into the kingdom - and live in a winsome way that draws them in. That is what Salaam Project is all about. But CR World Missions has survived for 125 years because people were also willing to give of their hard earned income and many have heard the Gospel because of it. So I would say yes, reach out to your neighbor locally, but if you feel called to support your missionaries through prayer and finances - go for it. Thanks for blogging.
Greg
Posted in: How do we respond to groups such as ISIS, Boko Haram and al-Qaeda?
Thank you Salaam for your comments and I especially liked your comment about the power of love overcoming the love of power. The problem that ISIS is presenting to the world is a serious one, and I noticed in the news that even the Pope has changed track and allowed for limited military engagement to protect religious minorities in Iraq. He did say that they should be stopped although he did not want to use the word bombed. He also (rightly I think) urged more of a UN response rather than a unilateral US response. The protection of religious minorities is a clear need in this case (Christian and other). But I hesitate to promote the use of force further than necessary - especially as other factors play into the stability of Iraq - sunni - shia conflict for example. It is not always easy to separate the spiritual from the political in the Middle East. To quote Dr. Shenk, Muhammad rode into Mecca with an army of 10,000 soldiers. Jesus road into Jerusalem on a donkey surrounded by children. It seems that our default position should be to seek peace, encourage Muslims to speak out against violence as a doctrine of jihad, find peace building opportunities for dialogue (perhaps around the minority view that violent passages of the Quran are limited to the time of Muhammad). In general help Muslims find peace. I think the Saudi ruling class is just as alarmed by ISIS as a threat to their state as is the West, so perhaps this opens up new opportunities to rethink Wahabi teaching.
Posted in: As the Pendulum Swings: From Christian Zionism to Christian Palestinianism?
Hello Salaam,
While I don't disagree that humans seem to swing on the pendulum, I think moving away from Christian Zionism to Christian Palestinianism is positive - if only as a corrective to a theological error. The fact is that Israel has forfeited the covenant as a nation - the hope of individual Jews is found in Jesus Christ. The hope of individual Palestinians is found in Jesus Christ. Therefore we no longer have a theological reason to prop up Israel. Yes Israel has every right to exist as a nation and to protect itself. But as Christians we are also concerned about the plight of the oppressed, the poor, the prisoner, and the Palestinians are prisoners in Gaza. So I don't think it is anti-semitic to hold Israel accountable for their actions in Gaza. I support some pendulum swinging - but as with all things - not too far.
Posted in: Should Muslims who become Christians remain in the mosque?
Thank you for the comments. The chapter in Tennant's book is very good. The point about Luke 8 is well raised. God uses all kinds of approaches and in this case a very open approach worked well in this context. Within Israel Jesus often asked people to keep quiet until the time came for him to be fully revealed. I think giving believers the freedom to follow the Spirit's leading as to how open they are about their new faith is what is important. One book I recommend in this regard is "A Wind in the House of Islam," by David Garrison.
Posted in: Are All Muslims out to Dominate the World and Impose Sharia Law on the Rest of the Population of Countries Like Canada and the United States?
Thank you Salaam for your reply. I appreciate your responses and admit that we do need to hear both sides of this debate.The way in which Christians respond to Muslims will only become more and more imperative as globalization continues to bring us together. My goal is to break down some of the barriers that have been built up in the media and other places that separate our two faiths. We have been led to believe there has to be a clash of civilizations and that religion leads to conflict (aka Richard Dawkins). On the other hand, I am not so naive that I do not see challenges to other faiths in the Islamic worldview (particularly their desire to create an Islamic state). However we have to be careful that our efforts to label the other in certain ways does not blind us to our own militaristic efforts to spread western ideas (conflated with Christianity).
I do have Abdu Murray's book on my reading list so hopefully I will get to that in the next few months. In my efforts to build bridges with people of other faiths I continue to believe that Jesus is the only way, truth and life and that there is only one mediator between God and humankind. I just want to steer clear of religious arrogance that is based more in religious systems rather than actual faith in Jesus. Thank you for mentioning that fear mongering is not our best approach. I continue to be concerned about the level of anti-Muslim sentiment in our churches and hope that we can find a realistic and peace oriented approach to our Muslim neighbors.
Posted in: Is the Quran the Divine Word of God?
Thank you for your comments Mike. I agree that the world is fallen and that culture and religion are affected by the fall. So I don't discount this and I don't want to give the impression that I think that followers of other faiths can avoid the punishment that comes from sin. I would rather seize the "grains of truth" and point people to the Gospel. So my desire to respect Muslims, learn from them, and dialogue with them comes with a firm belief that salvation is found in Jesus Christ and only through Jesus, the one Mediator between God and human kind. So in my desire to find "truth" in other faith systems, I ultimately want to help people find Jesus. This can lead to some tensions as we dialogue with other faiths (how can we dialogue when we are trying to convert?). I think that we have to allow the Holy Spirit to lead and as we follow the Missio Dei and then reach out honestly and with humility to people of other faiths.
Posted in: Is the Quran the Divine Word of God?
Thank you Salaam for your comments. As I replied also to Mike, I do not wish to discount our "unregenerate hearts." Romans 1 would back you up for sure. Your last paragraph is true, in Islam Muhammad has eclipsed Jesus and the Umma has replaced the Church. Muslims do not think of "salvation' in the same way that Christians, because they lack a true picture of the fall and the depths of our depravity. These are all points well taken and I hope that we do not minimize these serious differences in our approach.
I think my attempts to build a bridge relate more to seeing the Quran and the Bible as sacred texts for two different populations, the former being influenced by the latter (my view, it would not be held by Islamic theologians). So in respecting their text and their beliefs I seek to find points of connection. This in no way legitimizes the Quran theologically or attempts to put them on the same level. I simply want to learn from my Muslim friend how he understands the Quran and compare it to the Bible, hopefully shedding light on God's path of salvation through out history. I would hope that my Muslim friend would be interested in reading the Bible as instructed in the Quran. In the process I am aware of the dangers of comparing terms and beliefs and infusing them with my understandings. Hopefully dialogue will help with truly understanding the other - a mixture of appreciating the other's beliefs but also challenging them where they are different.
Ignoring the "slough of despond" would indeed be wrong but I do not think it is the best place to start with our Muslim friends (it may have more traction with agnostics/atheists).
Posted in: Reading the Quran: A Good Idea or a Bad Idea?
Thanks for the comments - it is good to see this Muslim ministry forum in use. I hope it will foster more good discussions. I appreciate the cautions and understand clearly the anti-Christian polemical nature of the Quran. Salvation is not found there. However I do find that my own understanding of Christian theology has been enhanced through reading the Quran. So to respond to Salaam, I am not thinking of it as a entre but rather appreciating the beauty of our theology (specifically the Trinity). This could be used in an apologetic way as well. To illustrate in another way, if the eternal word of Allah is the Quran, and the Quran exists eternally, than is Allah truly one - or is he two? In Christianity the eternal word of God - Jesus - exists eternally and because we have a trinitarian understanding of God, we can accept this fact. So I have a better appreciation of my own faith in the end.
Posted in: First of Seven Hard Questions
Thanks for your question Kim. I had not thought about the implications of the Shahada. The question of Muhammad is a good one. He did not point people to the God of the Christians, although he was more sympathetic in his Meccan suras. In fact, I believe he saw himself as a prophet to the Jews and Christians as well as the Muslims at that stage. It was only later in Medina that this seems to have changed. What we can say is that Muhammad was a reformer who sought to convert his people from polytheism to monotheism. All monotheists, including Christians, should appreciate this. So I maintain that we worship the same God, however, we fundamentally understand him in different ways. Certainly Muhammad did. In terms of how we relate to Muslims, I would speak of Muhammad as a God seeker and a reformer in his culture. We don't encourage conversation by speaking ill of him. But pointing people to Jesus, the ultimate reformer is our goal.