As an introvert with a high need for expression I am an oddball in church. I thrive on teaching and big groups don't bother me. Because I am passionate in the pulpit people are disappointed with me in the pew. I now respond that thank goodness I'm a bit more outgoing in the pulpit. It took me a long time to stop accepting the criticism with the intent of becoming an extrovert. When I am on "duty" I am as outgoing as possible. When I am a parishioner I try to reach out to those who would like a friendly hello but don't want the hug, the small talk and the forced cup of coffee. I often end up having deeper conversations by not offering these other ways of relating.
Thanks for posting this and the feedback you got from pastors.
I was part of church that was going through immense change. Though it was all approved by Council there was a lot of confusion and missed communication. While being very frustrated by the process I read a book "Loving the Church You Lead". I know it is obvious that we should love those we are leading but in all truthfulness I knew that part of my motivation was to change the church so I could love it in its new state. Taking the time to learn about the different people and to listen to their motivations and love for the church taught me much. It also changed my persective of success - the process has to be loving but firm and must be given the time to form trust and relationships. I imagine pastors already know this but as a lay person this was a tremendous growth in my spiritual formation. I ended up being caught between two unhappy camps of people trying to work as a reconciler by first meeting with and learning about people I only knew from angry comments in meetings. It also meant that when, sadly, the pastor moved on, I still had a body of believers that I was part of which crossed against the different dividing factors. It helped me to stay in the church for a longer season.
For the laity out there maybe this is a role you are called to play. Leaders need help in getting communication and understanding out to everyone. This helped me love the people and the church and to see my own sin in my own motivations.
Oops, I'm sorry I missed part of your question. Former VBS participants should be treated like any other adult volunteer. Sadly it cannot be assumed that younger children are safe with teens. I have found it difficult to get many church members to appreciate the risk so it is wise to get the information from Safe Church as the other contributor mentioned.
Thank-you Terry! My board was wondering if we could sign up for CCCC via the denomination but I suspected we would need to get our own registration. I have found them essential when I was working in small grass route charities but the board is not as familiar with them. I had forgotten about charitylaw.ca and will add them to my resources.
I'm so thankful to have a place to ask questions like these!
I am repairing some Bibles using white glue following some instructions on the web. Depending on the value of the books (monetary or sentimental) it may be more expensive to have them professionally repaired than the value of the book. Many sites offer solutions based on the type of fix that is required some use tape and some use glue. Just note that when they say "polyvinyl acetate adhesive (PVA)" usually white glue will do.
If found this information was helpful as it was not as exacting as what a professional would use and gives ideas as to the types of supplies you could use: http://www.wikihow.com/Repair-a-Book's-Binding
I have been in a ministry where we did allow some volunteers limited duties without the full police check - ONLY if they are never left alone with children and are under the direction of fully screened volunteers. In essence they become more people to keep track of. For example volunteers helping out in the kitchen who have no direct contact with the children. It is not my preference.
I am very passionate about linking the work of the church with the work of the community. I recently spent a few years trying to form a network of local churches to join in with other initiatives in the community. The local city councilor was very supportive and actually hosted a meeting for the churches. the Board of Ed already had started to create a local network where we were invited to join along with social work, employment initiatives, the Jewish community, police and others.
I could not get this off the ground. I found it very hard to get churches to send a rep to meetings or to even find what our common vision was - the belief was we had to "do something" but beyond that it was tough.
I am now in another church for an internship anxious to involve ourselves with the local neighbourhood association. It was my intent to start out small and join in the neighbourhood clean up event. This has been met with "don't spend your time on this".
This is my reality in urban Canada. I'm hoping that I will learn some approaches from others!
Thanks! I can't believe 3 years later I am looking for the same resources again :) If anyone else is interested the group is now called Compass and their website is under review at the moment. For Canadians I strongly recommend the Canadian Council of Christian Charities www.CCCC.org Their is a fee based on the size of your church. I have used it in connection with another charity and it was invaluable.
I'm not a church planter which is maybe why I am really turned off by this idea - but since you asked for feedback here are my initial thoughts. Having worked with struggling churches I know full well the pain of the lost generation (which every denomination suffers from) and the longing for the church to be more of what the dream was in the past.
It s a completely different scenario if the nest church invites a church plant to reach people they know are out there but they cannot do due to their own commitments in other areas or lack of expertise in the community they wish to reach. But the scenario as it is offered seems to be "well the church is dying, they can't get a pastor so why let the building go to waste". I am reading a bias in the scenario which seems to assume that the people in the church do not want the same things as the church plant and thus a separate governance system is required.
There must be benefits to the host church that I am missing or it would sound very much like this scenario:
IBM operates a computer shop which has hit rough times and may have to close. Apple comes and offers to use their facilities, computers and phones so they can reach new customers. They make it clear that they do not want IBM calling any of the shots because they don't need their help - after all they are failing. How gracious does IBM need to be to see this as a benefit to them and the customers they cannot secure, how gracious is Apple being to IBM?
I've only been around church life for about 9 years so I still find myself stumbling over culture. What I mean is when I talk to a church planter I sense that we use language differently and our perspectives may not be understood while we share ideas..
I'm not sure the question should be "How do we best plant new churches?". As you point out each scenario is different and so the quesiton I would prefer to see is how do we "see" opportunites in the mission field where our unique gifts are desired to be put to use by God?
This is why I am uncomfortable with the top down approach that I am experiencing in the church planting movement in my area of Canada. As laity I may well see opportunities but am unable to interest my church in pursuing them. Yet as laity I am also removed from the process in which we select new mission fields so as to point them out to others in the denomination who might be able to fill the opportunity. I don't really understand how new sites are chosen (or old ones adopted).
I have talked to pastors in Toronto that spend a great deal of time looking for facilities. I don't really understand this because it would seem to me that to plant a church you would start with where you are a good fit then make do with what is available. Which is why I tend to think of planting ministries rather than planting churches with the idea that the ministry will grow larger as more of the local people become engaged and take ownership.
I think his might be a totally different model?
Thanks for your insight - I am more on the laity side of things.
Posted in: Introverts in the Church
As an introvert with a high need for expression I am an oddball in church. I thrive on teaching and big groups don't bother me. Because I am passionate in the pulpit people are disappointed with me in the pew. I now respond that thank goodness I'm a bit more outgoing in the pulpit. It took me a long time to stop accepting the criticism with the intent of becoming an extrovert. When I am on "duty" I am as outgoing as possible. When I am a parishioner I try to reach out to those who would like a friendly hello but don't want the hug, the small talk and the forced cup of coffee. I often end up having deeper conversations by not offering these other ways of relating.
Posted in: See Change
Thanks for posting this and the feedback you got from pastors.
I was part of church that was going through immense change. Though it was all approved by Council there was a lot of confusion and missed communication. While being very frustrated by the process I read a book "Loving the Church You Lead". I know it is obvious that we should love those we are leading but in all truthfulness I knew that part of my motivation was to change the church so I could love it in its new state. Taking the time to learn about the different people and to listen to their motivations and love for the church taught me much. It also changed my persective of success - the process has to be loving but firm and must be given the time to form trust and relationships. I imagine pastors already know this but as a lay person this was a tremendous growth in my spiritual formation. I ended up being caught between two unhappy camps of people trying to work as a reconciler by first meeting with and learning about people I only knew from angry comments in meetings. It also meant that when, sadly, the pastor moved on, I still had a body of believers that I was part of which crossed against the different dividing factors. It helped me to stay in the church for a longer season.
For the laity out there maybe this is a role you are called to play. Leaders need help in getting communication and understanding out to everyone. This helped me love the people and the church and to see my own sin in my own motivations.
Blessings!
Posted in: Background Checks for VBS Volunteers?
Oops, I'm sorry I missed part of your question. Former VBS participants should be treated like any other adult volunteer. Sadly it cannot be assumed that younger children are safe with teens. I have found it difficult to get many church members to appreciate the risk so it is wise to get the information from Safe Church as the other contributor mentioned.
Posted in: Security Protocol for Disruptive People in Church Services
Hi Eric...I am having trouble with the link you have provided. Could you check it for me?
Thanks, Victoria
Posted in: What Is the Best Way to Keep up to Date With Administration Requirements for Churches and Charities?
Thanks so much Dick. Hamilton Classis has a lot of information that will help me.
I have to remember how far reaching the Network is for future questions!
Victoria
Posted in: What Is the Best Way to Keep up to Date With Administration Requirements for Churches and Charities?
Thank-you Terry! My board was wondering if we could sign up for CCCC via the denomination but I suspected we would need to get our own registration. I have found them essential when I was working in small grass route charities but the board is not as familiar with them. I had forgotten about charitylaw.ca and will add them to my resources.
I'm so thankful to have a place to ask questions like these!
Victoria
Posted in: Hard Cover Book Repair Ideas?
I am repairing some Bibles using white glue following some instructions on the web. Depending on the value of the books (monetary or sentimental) it may be more expensive to have them professionally repaired than the value of the book. Many sites offer solutions based on the type of fix that is required some use tape and some use glue. Just note that when they say "polyvinyl acetate adhesive (PVA)" usually white glue will do.
If found this information was helpful as it was not as exacting as what a professional would use and gives ideas as to the types of supplies you could use: http://www.wikihow.com/Repair-a-Book's-Binding
Hope this helps lead you to a solution!
Victoria
Posted in: Background Checks for VBS Volunteers?
I have been in a ministry where we did allow some volunteers limited duties without the full police check - ONLY if they are never left alone with children and are under the direction of fully screened volunteers. In essence they become more people to keep track of. For example volunteers helping out in the kitchen who have no direct contact with the children. It is not my preference.
Posted in: Do you have information about Community Ministry Networks?
I am very passionate about linking the work of the church with the work of the community. I recently spent a few years trying to form a network of local churches to join in with other initiatives in the community. The local city councilor was very supportive and actually hosted a meeting for the churches. the Board of Ed already had started to create a local network where we were invited to join along with social work, employment initiatives, the Jewish community, police and others.
I could not get this off the ground. I found it very hard to get churches to send a rep to meetings or to even find what our common vision was - the belief was we had to "do something" but beyond that it was tough.
I am now in another church for an internship anxious to involve ourselves with the local neighbourhood association. It was my intent to start out small and join in the neighbourhood clean up event. This has been met with "don't spend your time on this".
This is my reality in urban Canada. I'm hoping that I will learn some approaches from others!
Posted in: What Books or Web Resources Are Recommended for Persons Working With Canadian Church Budgets and Finances?
Thanks! I can't believe 3 years later I am looking for the same resources again :) If anyone else is interested the group is now called Compass and their website is under review at the moment. For Canadians I strongly recommend the Canadian Council of Christian Charities www.CCCC.org Their is a fee based on the size of your church. I have used it in connection with another charity and it was invaluable.
Blessings, Victoria
Posted in: What Do You Think of Planting a New Community in a Declining Church?
I'm not a church planter which is maybe why I am really turned off by this idea - but since you asked for feedback here are my initial thoughts. Having worked with struggling churches I know full well the pain of the lost generation (which every denomination suffers from) and the longing for the church to be more of what the dream was in the past.
It s a completely different scenario if the nest church invites a church plant to reach people they know are out there but they cannot do due to their own commitments in other areas or lack of expertise in the community they wish to reach. But the scenario as it is offered seems to be "well the church is dying, they can't get a pastor so why let the building go to waste". I am reading a bias in the scenario which seems to assume that the people in the church do not want the same things as the church plant and thus a separate governance system is required.
There must be benefits to the host church that I am missing or it would sound very much like this scenario:
IBM operates a computer shop which has hit rough times and may have to close. Apple comes and offers to use their facilities, computers and phones so they can reach new customers. They make it clear that they do not want IBM calling any of the shots because they don't need their help - after all they are failing. How gracious does IBM need to be to see this as a benefit to them and the customers they cannot secure, how gracious is Apple being to IBM?
Victoria
Posted in: What Do You Think of Planting a New Community in a Declining Church?
Hi John:
I've only been around church life for about 9 years so I still find myself stumbling over culture. What I mean is when I talk to a church planter I sense that we use language differently and our perspectives may not be understood while we share ideas..
I'm not sure the question should be "How do we best plant new churches?". As you point out each scenario is different and so the quesiton I would prefer to see is how do we "see" opportunites in the mission field where our unique gifts are desired to be put to use by God?
This is why I am uncomfortable with the top down approach that I am experiencing in the church planting movement in my area of Canada. As laity I may well see opportunities but am unable to interest my church in pursuing them. Yet as laity I am also removed from the process in which we select new mission fields so as to point them out to others in the denomination who might be able to fill the opportunity. I don't really understand how new sites are chosen (or old ones adopted).
I have talked to pastors in Toronto that spend a great deal of time looking for facilities. I don't really understand this because it would seem to me that to plant a church you would start with where you are a good fit then make do with what is available. Which is why I tend to think of planting ministries rather than planting churches with the idea that the ministry will grow larger as more of the local people become engaged and take ownership.
I think his might be a totally different model?
Thanks for your insight - I am more on the laity side of things.
Victoria