I grew up in the CRC, and am still here, along with my family. I'm married to Daryl, who has a construction business. I had a CPA license for 10 or so years, then I added EX to the front, and MOM to the back, so now I'm an EX CPA, MOM =). I am MOM to Duncan, Ian and Samantha. Our family also owns a raspberry farm, and in the summers we get to work out there.
For the record, the Holy Spirit is a Person, not an it...God in 3 Persons... Blessed Trinity...
I know we all know that, but I just wanted to recognize God for Who He is...Having stated that...I'm very grateful to see that we in the CRC are starting to realize, that One Person of the Trinity has been sadly neglected in our reformed history (and other denominations as well) for various reasons, and that it is time to change that...PTL!! I have read Gordon Fee, Francis Chan and John Algera's books, as well as the synodical reports from 1973 and 2009 on the 2nd and 3rd wave of pentecostalism. I also pray and worship with a lot of pentecostals, and learn a lot from these fellow brothers and sisters in the LORD, who have been much more open to the Spirit for a long time, and I think we can learn a lot from them, if we are willing to go beyond our denominational walls. God says we are a body, that isn't just in our local church, but ALL of His churches, and He designed that we work together. We are not complete if we are closed to the gifts the Holy Spirit has blessed other denominations with.
You mentioned seeing how the Holy Spirit fits into our CRC culture - have you ever discussed praying in tongues in a CRC crowd?- Interesting responses, both verbal and non-verbal! and that's just one "unusual" gift He gives us. Discussing the gift of prophecy (the prophetic) can also cause quite a stir - especially if you go beyond the definition that it is basically the same as preaching. The Holy Spirit is not an option/program, in case He doesn't "fit", and we do not want to quench Him/limit Him anymore than we already have...
God is more concerned with how we, the CRC, fit into His Kingdom, then how He fits into our crc "kingdom"...
LORD, forgive us for when we have quenched Your Holy Spirit in the past ...transform our denomination through the power of Your Holy Spirit...
I'm so glad Marlin shared...as a member of the same church, I will confirm that the council did a good job...i would even say great job, of leading the congregation through some tough issues...the prayer was key, and I think a beautiful testimony of how God honors when we seek to do it His way, not our way...then the "conversations" were great for bringing communication to a more comprehensive level for anyone interested. There was good "sharpening", but also a good sense of community, as we wrestled with these concerns together. Marlin didn't share this, so I will...he helped facilitate most of them, and I definitely sensed that he was being led by the Spirit through it. Also, last night we had a "fun" conversation that focused on the various ministries going on in the church (instead of something controversial), and supporting and encouraging each other.
I am in total agreement with Marlin, prayer and open communication were key in our congregation. It really seemed the Holy Spirit helped us with an attitude of love and honor, even when in disagreement. I am also truly amazed at how God has worked in our church over the last year, and my prayer is that every Kingdom church will experience Him anew.
I will second Jack's #1 - prayer, prayer and more prayer (that's 3 principles, right? =)... especially time listening together in prayer.. you want the vision to come from the Holy Spirit. So bring a focus before the LORD, spend time listening for His direction. Crazy stuff happens when you start "hearing" Him.
If you aren't familiar with listening prayer, you will want to be, so that you can test and discern the thoughts that are shared through this time. there are some great books on it, I would say Brad Jersak's "can you hear Me? - tuning in to the God that speaks is a very practical one that helps teach concepts on "listening" to the Holy Spirit.
It seems, we often don't intentionally seek the Holy Spirit's guidance, we just hope and pray that He gives it to us, but it is not intentional, quiet time, listening for what He wants to share. Lots of reasons for this.
So, I pray that you and your team will be led into His vision that He has prepared in advance for you and your congregation, but I also pray that you will have amazing experiences encountering God through listening to the Holy Spirit.
Ken, my family would love to meet you/your family...You are in the Lynden area as well? We would love to hear your testimonies of how the Holy Spirit has been working in your life...please feel free to email us @ [email protected]
God is definitely connecting His body, crossing some traditional barriers... Thank You Jesus!! :) Bev S
Ha, Rod, that reminds me of Numbers 12:3 where Moses (most likely) under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit wrote...now the man Moses was very humble, more than all men who were on the face of the earth... it was probably an interesting discussion between Moses and God with Moses possibly saying "Do I have to write that?"
haha... you can always challenge the congregation to double their giving!! really! on 1.1.11 we were so challenged at a non crc worship gathering, and after the first gasp for air, like "Really LORD? cash flow already sucks!". But we had been praying into God's economy and know that giving is a significant key to His economy, and so my husband and I prayed about it, and the LORD gave us a strategic plan of increasing our giving 1% per month, so it wasn't quite such a shock all at once. Just a week ago, I was making some year end up adjustments for his business and happened to look at our net income for the year, and it was up SIGNIFICANTLY! and he's in construction, so we know the economy hasn't changed that much. and that's just one of the blessings we've experienced!!
What a beautiful family =) and testimony.. (and name!!) . Praise God...thank you so much for sharing... isn't it crazy how the Word becomes much more living and active when you're listening to Him?
So who do you get to "listen" and pray with that have so much experience? That is awesome... would love to hear more about your journey. We are in training... Really excited about the appointment of Moses Chung as director of Home missions...a Spirit led man of prayer...he just spent 3 years in S Korea in "the" praying church... if you have a few minutes (about 18- I know how that can be with little ones=) and haven't already done so... watch his "welcome" speech from synod, he so resonated with my heart for prayer, especially about 12-13 minutes in...
the CRC staff separated his speech out so you can watch it, but you might want to watch the intro as well, which you will have to go to Tues pm1 for...
Hey Rich... welcome... good to see you on here... if you don't remember, I met you a prayer summit @ Cedar Springs a few years back... great thoughts and insight... thx. for sharing...
definitely thought you guys looked young enough that they were yours =)
I re-read my post on the link and realized the "about 12-13 minutes in" could be read 2 different ways.... so when you watch the link, Moses really starts talking about his prayer journey in Korea, that starts at about 12 or 13 minutes in, and this goes through about 17 minutes or so, just in case you are listening for it only between 12-13 minutes... sorry if I caused confusion
That is so interesting and excitiing how God is connecting us in the area of listening prayer... I too, have prayed with others involved in healing prayer ministries (but not CRC or even reformed backgrounds), and went through some training for this. At this point in my life - with little ones (11, 7 and 5), I don't get to go in and pray with them very often, so most of my prayer time is at home... we do pray together as a family every night before bed, and, especially if we need direction with something, take time for listening prayer... my son, who's 11 has several testimonies of scriptures the LORD put on his heart that were beautiful answers to what we were asking.
One testimony is last Christmas, I asked him to sing with me in a combined church Christmas cantata that brought singers from the local CRC's together, since they were organizing a youth choir to participate as well. So I mentioned it to him, and his response was "do I have to?" My response, was, "no, you get to sing, but you have to have a good attitude." So, that night when we had our prayer time together, I said, let's ask God, whether He wants you to sing in this cantata. We were quiet about 5 minutes, I rec'd a scripture, but didn't share it right away, and then I asked him if he had any thoughts or any scriptures came to him... He said "Isaiah 5"... I asked him, "do you know what Is. 5 says?" He responded "no", so we looked it up, and Is. 5 is the "Song of the Vineyard" and starts with... now let me sing to my Well-beloved... So I asked my son, what he thought God was telling him, and he said "Sing!" (can't get any clearer than that!) and for the next half hour, he continued to receive more scripture references about singing...
The scripture that "popped" into my head was "make a joyful noise!" We both sang in the Christmas cantata last year =) !
Now, there's a whole lot more to this story...because when we showed up at the first practice, by the time we started practicing the first song, it was my attitude that was not good (and that's putting it mildly)... and I just realized as I was writing this, that God was going to hold me to the words I said to my son and wanted me to sing it with the right attitude as well... and boy, did He ever "undo" my bad attiude... the first verse, I didn't even know what I was singing I was so mad, in the second verse He melted the hardness in my heart and by the 3rd verse I was a basket case about ready to walk out because I did not know what I was going to do with all the "fluids" flowing from various places of my face... I had NOT "listened" to the prompting of the Holy Spirit as I walked in to practice that "you might want to get some kleenex"...My intellect immediately responsed to that with a snarky thought..."why would I need kleenex for practice?" and dismissed the thought... it was what I call a "terrible, beautiful" experience of being "undone", taking out the ugliness that was in my heart, and replacing it with a beautiful piece of His heart...
I don't mind being more specific about what was going on and why I was mad and how He got my attention, but it gets kind of long for this post... I will work on writing that out, and maybe if the network gets a testimony tab (hint hint moderators;-), I can post it under that some time =)...
I can't wait to hear about your trip...that is way cool... I sensed the Spirit when I read about it, and now again, when I'm thinking about it (I just read it again, and I felt another wave of the Spirit)... If you are blogging on it, let me know where I can find that... would love to hear everything... It's going to be amazing...
Well, I have been to a number of prayer retreats. several were pastor/prayer leader summits. Some were 3 days, some are 1/2 day, about 4 hours, and some are 1-2 days, some included some teaching. Some were facilitated by Dennis Fuqua, who uses a wonderful, fresh approach to prayer, and focuses a lot on worship based prayer. I think having someone like Dennis come for a weekend to teach, preach and pray with a church or several churches would be very helpful in expanding/growing a church's/community's prayer life. It opens the door to praying differently then we have traditionally prayed in our reformed tradition. It's not wild and crazy, but beautiful and sweet, with everything directed by the Holy Spirit, and straight out of scripture... something our conservative inclinations can be ok with. Dennis is a very down to earth man of prayer, and we've appreciated his leading through his sensitivity to the Holy Spirit in growing the level of prayer in our area. let me find the link to his ministry, International Renewal:
I also get together regularly with Dr. Alvin Vander Griend, Author of love to pray, and a founder of the Harvest Prayer Ministries. I know he has amazing and powerful teachings on prayer, with very practical guides to help the church grow a "culture of prayer."
The board for the prayer center i help serve on, tries to have a quarterly prayer retreat. So far, these have been 9-4ish on a Friday or Sat. We will spend time confessing and praying for each other (James 5:16). We will pray about different ministries connected to the prayer center, we will pray for prayer events, we will pray for our prayer missionaries, etc. ...let's see how does that translate into a church... confessing is same, praying for ministries would be sunday school, cadet/gem programs, catechism classes, bible studies, nursery, music, youth group, whatever you guys have going on, and then also maybe praying for para church ministries that your members are involved with like feeding homeless and poor, schools, supporting single moms, or whatever it might be. You can also pray for denominational leaders (ie Board of Trustees, Executive Director, Home Missions Director and their staff) and issues, which we generally don't get to spend very much corporate prayer time on.
and then just pray for the Holy Spirit to pour out through prayer...
I've had extended times of prayer together from 2+ plus hours to 3 days, some were held at church, some were at a retreat facility. I will say, most people, including most pastors, are not ready for 3 days for various reasons, but hopefully that day is coming to the crc =)
Steve, there are lots of options, and I think you get to pray into what God wants it to look like for your church. some questions: What are the funds available for it? How busy people are might limit it to an evening or an evening and part of the next day, but a prayer retreat is far better than meeting the Pres. of the US. You would drop everything you have going on for that opportunity =), right? We get to meet with this amazing God of the universe, our Creator, the One Who loves us beyond our wildest imagination!
Hope and pray you have a powerful and profound prayer retreat where you encounter God in fresh and beautiful ways!
I wish we did have some experience with this Tim... I will pass this on to Alvin VG, if he has any insight for you, we are on a prayer board together, and our meeting is tomorrow...
Posted in: What are some good study materials for learning about the Holy Spirit?
For the record, the Holy Spirit is a Person, not an it...God in 3 Persons... Blessed Trinity...
I know we all know that, but I just wanted to recognize God for Who He is...Having stated that...I'm very grateful to see that we in the CRC are starting to realize, that One Person of the Trinity has been sadly neglected in our reformed history (and other denominations as well) for various reasons, and that it is time to change that...PTL!! I have read Gordon Fee, Francis Chan and John Algera's books, as well as the synodical reports from 1973 and 2009 on the 2nd and 3rd wave of pentecostalism. I also pray and worship with a lot of pentecostals, and learn a lot from these fellow brothers and sisters in the LORD, who have been much more open to the Spirit for a long time, and I think we can learn a lot from them, if we are willing to go beyond our denominational walls. God says we are a body, that isn't just in our local church, but ALL of His churches, and He designed that we work together. We are not complete if we are closed to the gifts the Holy Spirit has blessed other denominations with.
You mentioned seeing how the Holy Spirit fits into our CRC culture - have you ever discussed praying in tongues in a CRC crowd?- Interesting responses, both verbal and non-verbal! and that's just one "unusual" gift He gives us. Discussing the gift of prophecy (the prophetic) can also cause quite a stir - especially if you go beyond the definition that it is basically the same as preaching. The Holy Spirit is not an option/program, in case He doesn't "fit", and we do not want to quench Him/limit Him anymore than we already have...
God is more concerned with how we, the CRC, fit into His Kingdom, then how He fits into our crc "kingdom"...
LORD, forgive us for when we have quenched Your Holy Spirit in the past ...transform our denomination through the power of Your Holy Spirit...
Posted in: What are best practices for conducting a Congregational Meeting dealing with controversial issues?
I'm so glad Marlin shared...as a member of the same church, I will confirm that the council did a good job...i would even say great job, of leading the congregation through some tough issues...the prayer was key, and I think a beautiful testimony of how God honors when we seek to do it His way, not our way...then the "conversations" were great for bringing communication to a more comprehensive level for anyone interested. There was good "sharpening", but also a good sense of community, as we wrestled with these concerns together. Marlin didn't share this, so I will...he helped facilitate most of them, and I definitely sensed that he was being led by the Spirit through it. Also, last night we had a "fun" conversation that focused on the various ministries going on in the church (instead of something controversial), and supporting and encouraging each other.
I am in total agreement with Marlin, prayer and open communication were key in our congregation. It really seemed the Holy Spirit helped us with an attitude of love and honor, even when in disagreement. I am also truly amazed at how God has worked in our church over the last year, and my prayer is that every Kingdom church will experience Him anew.
Posted in: What are your three principles for running a good "vision meeting?"
I will second Jack's #1 - prayer, prayer and more prayer (that's 3 principles, right? =)... especially time listening together in prayer.. you want the vision to come from the Holy Spirit. So bring a focus before the LORD, spend time listening for His direction. Crazy stuff happens when you start "hearing" Him.
If you aren't familiar with listening prayer, you will want to be, so that you can test and discern the thoughts that are shared through this time. there are some great books on it, I would say Brad Jersak's "can you hear Me? - tuning in to the God that speaks is a very practical one that helps teach concepts on "listening" to the Holy Spirit.
It seems, we often don't intentionally seek the Holy Spirit's guidance, we just hope and pray that He gives it to us, but it is not intentional, quiet time, listening for what He wants to share. Lots of reasons for this.
So, I pray that you and your team will be led into His vision that He has prepared in advance for you and your congregation, but I also pray that you will have amazing experiences encountering God through listening to the Holy Spirit.
Posted in: What are some good study materials for learning about the Holy Spirit?
Ken, my family would love to meet you/your family...You are in the Lynden area as well? We would love to hear your testimonies of how the Holy Spirit has been working in your life...please feel free to email us @ [email protected]
God is definitely connecting His body, crossing some traditional barriers... Thank You Jesus!! :) Bev S
Posted in: How has the Article 7 change affected those seeking to become Ministers of the Word?
Ha, Rod, that reminds me of Numbers 12:3 where Moses (most likely) under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit wrote...now the man Moses was very humble, more than all men who were on the face of the earth... it was probably an interesting discussion between Moses and God with Moses possibly saying "Do I have to write that?"
Posted in: What can you do when your church is not meeting its budget?
haha... you can always challenge the congregation to double their giving!! really! on 1.1.11 we were so challenged at a non crc worship gathering, and after the first gasp for air, like "Really LORD? cash flow already sucks!". But we had been praying into God's economy and know that giving is a significant key to His economy, and so my husband and I prayed about it, and the LORD gave us a strategic plan of increasing our giving 1% per month, so it wasn't quite such a shock all at once. Just a week ago, I was making some year end up adjustments for his business and happened to look at our net income for the year, and it was up SIGNIFICANTLY! and he's in construction, so we know the economy hasn't changed that much. and that's just one of the blessings we've experienced!!
Posted in: What is listening prayer?
What a beautiful family =) and testimony.. (and name!!) . Praise God...thank you so much for sharing... isn't it crazy how the Word becomes much more living and active when you're listening to Him?
So who do you get to "listen" and pray with that have so much experience? That is awesome... would love to hear more about your journey. We are in training... Really excited about the appointment of Moses Chung as director of Home missions...a Spirit led man of prayer...he just spent 3 years in S Korea in "the" praying church... if you have a few minutes (about 18- I know how that can be with little ones=) and haven't already done so... watch his "welcome" speech from synod, he so resonated with my heart for prayer, especially about 12-13 minutes in...
the CRC staff separated his speech out so you can watch it, but you might want to watch the intro as well, which you will have to go to Tues pm1 for...
http://www.crcna.org/pages/synod_webcast_archive.cfm
bless your heart sister... with (spiritual) ears and eyes wide open
Posted in: Can you recommend any good books about rural church ministry?
Hey Rich... welcome... good to see you on here... if you don't remember, I met you a prayer summit @ Cedar Springs a few years back... great thoughts and insight... thx. for sharing...
Posted in: Can you recommend any good books about rural church ministry?
That is awesome!!! Thank You Jesus...
Posted in: What is listening prayer?
definitely thought you guys looked young enough that they were yours =)
I re-read my post on the link and realized the "about 12-13 minutes in" could be read 2 different ways.... so when you watch the link, Moses really starts talking about his prayer journey in Korea, that starts at about 12 or 13 minutes in, and this goes through about 17 minutes or so, just in case you are listening for it only between 12-13 minutes... sorry if I caused confusion
That is so interesting and excitiing how God is connecting us in the area of listening prayer... I too, have prayed with others involved in healing prayer ministries (but not CRC or even reformed backgrounds), and went through some training for this. At this point in my life - with little ones (11, 7 and 5), I don't get to go in and pray with them very often, so most of my prayer time is at home... we do pray together as a family every night before bed, and, especially if we need direction with something, take time for listening prayer... my son, who's 11 has several testimonies of scriptures the LORD put on his heart that were beautiful answers to what we were asking.
One testimony is last Christmas, I asked him to sing with me in a combined church Christmas cantata that brought singers from the local CRC's together, since they were organizing a youth choir to participate as well. So I mentioned it to him, and his response was "do I have to?" My response, was, "no, you get to sing, but you have to have a good attitude." So, that night when we had our prayer time together, I said, let's ask God, whether He wants you to sing in this cantata. We were quiet about 5 minutes, I rec'd a scripture, but didn't share it right away, and then I asked him if he had any thoughts or any scriptures came to him... He said "Isaiah 5"... I asked him, "do you know what Is. 5 says?" He responded "no", so we looked it up, and Is. 5 is the "Song of the Vineyard" and starts with... now let me sing to my Well-beloved... So I asked my son, what he thought God was telling him, and he said "Sing!" (can't get any clearer than that!) and for the next half hour, he continued to receive more scripture references about singing...
The scripture that "popped" into my head was "make a joyful noise!" We both sang in the Christmas cantata last year =) !
Now, there's a whole lot more to this story...because when we showed up at the first practice, by the time we started practicing the first song, it was my attitude that was not good (and that's putting it mildly)... and I just realized as I was writing this, that God was going to hold me to the words I said to my son and wanted me to sing it with the right attitude as well... and boy, did He ever "undo" my bad attiude... the first verse, I didn't even know what I was singing I was so mad, in the second verse He melted the hardness in my heart and by the 3rd verse I was a basket case about ready to walk out because I did not know what I was going to do with all the "fluids" flowing from various places of my face... I had NOT "listened" to the prompting of the Holy Spirit as I walked in to practice that "you might want to get some kleenex"...My intellect immediately responsed to that with a snarky thought..."why would I need kleenex for practice?" and dismissed the thought... it was what I call a "terrible, beautiful" experience of being "undone", taking out the ugliness that was in my heart, and replacing it with a beautiful piece of His heart...
I don't mind being more specific about what was going on and why I was mad and how He got my attention, but it gets kind of long for this post... I will work on writing that out, and maybe if the network gets a testimony tab (hint hint moderators;-), I can post it under that some time =)...
I can't wait to hear about your trip...that is way cool... I sensed the Spirit when I read about it, and now again, when I'm thinking about it (I just read it again, and I felt another wave of the Spirit)... If you are blogging on it, let me know where I can find that... would love to hear everything... It's going to be amazing...
In Him..
Posted in: What suggestions do you have for a church prayer retreat?
Well, I have been to a number of prayer retreats. several were pastor/prayer leader summits. Some were 3 days, some are 1/2 day, about 4 hours, and some are 1-2 days, some included some teaching. Some were facilitated by Dennis Fuqua, who uses a wonderful, fresh approach to prayer, and focuses a lot on worship based prayer. I think having someone like Dennis come for a weekend to teach, preach and pray with a church or several churches would be very helpful in expanding/growing a church's/community's prayer life. It opens the door to praying differently then we have traditionally prayed in our reformed tradition. It's not wild and crazy, but beautiful and sweet, with everything directed by the Holy Spirit, and straight out of scripture... something our conservative inclinations can be ok with. Dennis is a very down to earth man of prayer, and we've appreciated his leading through his sensitivity to the Holy Spirit in growing the level of prayer in our area. let me find the link to his ministry, International Renewal:
http://irm.livewebsitebuilder.com/
and this is another link for Dennis
http://livingprayerbook.web.officelive.com/aboutus.aspx
I also get together regularly with Dr. Alvin Vander Griend, Author of love to pray, and a founder of the Harvest Prayer Ministries. I know he has amazing and powerful teachings on prayer, with very practical guides to help the church grow a "culture of prayer."
The board for the prayer center i help serve on, tries to have a quarterly prayer retreat. So far, these have been 9-4ish on a Friday or Sat. We will spend time confessing and praying for each other (James 5:16). We will pray about different ministries connected to the prayer center, we will pray for prayer events, we will pray for our prayer missionaries, etc. ...let's see how does that translate into a church... confessing is same, praying for ministries would be sunday school, cadet/gem programs, catechism classes, bible studies, nursery, music, youth group, whatever you guys have going on, and then also maybe praying for para church ministries that your members are involved with like feeding homeless and poor, schools, supporting single moms, or whatever it might be. You can also pray for denominational leaders (ie Board of Trustees, Executive Director, Home Missions Director and their staff) and issues, which we generally don't get to spend very much corporate prayer time on.
and then just pray for the Holy Spirit to pour out through prayer...
I've had extended times of prayer together from 2+ plus hours to 3 days, some were held at church, some were at a retreat facility. I will say, most people, including most pastors, are not ready for 3 days for various reasons, but hopefully that day is coming to the crc =)
Steve, there are lots of options, and I think you get to pray into what God wants it to look like for your church. some questions: What are the funds available for it? How busy people are might limit it to an evening or an evening and part of the next day, but a prayer retreat is far better than meeting the Pres. of the US. You would drop everything you have going on for that opportunity =), right? We get to meet with this amazing God of the universe, our Creator, the One Who loves us beyond our wildest imagination!
Hope and pray you have a powerful and profound prayer retreat where you encounter God in fresh and beautiful ways!
Posted in: Can you share your church's experience with "Strategic Prayer Initiative?"
I wish we did have some experience with this Tim... I will pass this on to Alvin VG, if he has any insight for you, we are on a prayer board together, and our meeting is tomorrow...